First rule of capo club is..

I don't understand the weird obsession some very good guitarists have with delay either. They don't really need it.
I use it a lot because I like the way I sound playing in stereo. It gives movement. But I use it at a low enough level, that you'd notice it more if I turned it off. This is in the context of when I used to gig as the sole guitarist, and now when I play at home w/o any backing tracks.
 
Under 30ms the human ear doesn't recognize it as a seperate sound, so sustain and "thickening" is a common use for always on Delay. Adding modulation and saturation can also be fun (Strymon Deco...). Stereo panning and ping-pong... and that's without trying to be The Edge or Gilmour.
 
I don't understand the weird obsession some very good guitarists have with delay either. They don't really need it. I confess that I am kinda jealous because I don't use it. But I like to hear others when they are using it as an effect.

Many local players I have seen who are much better guitarists than I am have an always on delay. Some also have a second delay pedal which they step on while soloing.

I enjoy seeing live looping, I admire guitarists who can do it. I can't. It's completely different than playing with an always on delay. It's much more challenging.

I believe different chord voicings (open strings or by using a capo) come handy when someone is playing with themselves using a looper.
Yes I do see a lot of guitarist using delay quite liberally and multiple delays with a 2nd delay pedal too. I don't use much, I do like a rockabilly style slapback delay with a short delay time and a single or double repeat at most, but that's about all I've done with delay so far.

If you want to experiment with a cool effect you can play around with tremelo (also called vibrato sometimes). Some amps have built in tremelo and there are some good tremelo pedals out there. Boss makes a good one called the TR-2 which is only $99 new and cheaper used. I like to set the pulse of the tremelo to the tempo of the song and it's a nice effect.

Live looping is hard to do, I tried working on it at home. It requires precise timing starting and ending the loop with the footswitch to pull it off in a live playing situation. So I haven't used it playing live. Maybe one of these days. It'll probly take practice doing it over and over to get it right.
 
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Yes I do see a lot of guitarist using delay quite liberally and multiple delays with a 2nd delay pedal too. I don't use much, I do like a rockabilly style slapback delay with a short delay time and a single or double repeat at most, but that's about all I've done with delay so far.

If you want to experiment with a cool effect you can play around with tremelo (also called vibrato sometimes). Some amps have built in tremelo and there are some good tremelo pedals out there. Boss makes a good one called the TR-2 which is only $99 new and cheaper used. I like to set the pulse of the tremelo to the tempo of the song and it's a nice effect.

Live looping is hard to do, I tried working on it at home. It requires precise timing starting and ending the loop with the footswitch to pull it off in a live playing situation. So I haven't used it playing live. Maybe one of these days. It'll probly take practice doing it over and over to get it right.
I've never understood why vibrato was every referred to as tremolo.

Leo was absolutely brilliant, but he got that one wrong.

Tremolo is the rise and fall in volume.
Vibrato is the rise and fall in pitch - in the actual note, itself.

Guitarists use many different types of finger vibrato all the time, for effect, to make a note sing.

They used to do tremolo with their amps (if it had that feature built-in. I might hasten to say that most do not, any longer). They'd also do it, using their their fingers, rolling on a volume knob on the guitar, or hands-free, on a volume pedal.

But, there are pretty incredible tremolo pedals that can let you be almost surgical in the control you have over many parameters, so you can dial it in perfectly - in time,or at a syncopated, complimentary timing with the music.

But - tremolo and vibrato are two entirely different animals.

I admit, until about five years ago, I didn't think I'd ever be interested in using a tremolo effect in any of my original music; but it's an amazing and dramatic effect, when used sparingly. I love it - especially in a stereo rig. That, combined with the panning effect feature (in some pedals) can create a huge soundscape. It can be very beautiful. I tend to use it in cleaner tones, and at lower speeds, almost primarily.

It can be used not just for soloing, but creating layers...pads (chordal, or otherwise), to build up huge ambient textures , and to create tension, like in a riveting movie soundtrack, for instance.

The Keeley Hydra (one of my favorite tremolo pedals) combines, both reverb, and tremolo (both stereo-capable, too!) into one compact box. It's a little expensive, but you essentially have two very nice pedals for the price of one high-end one - and you can use each effect separately, or combine the two, to your liking.

I have never tried looping anything, in a live setting, in front of an audience. Don't know that I could pull that off very successfully. i greatly admire those who can!
 
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When I had researched loopers, I had come across feature called "quantize".

Appearently not all loopers have it.

Basically it helps create clean loops by kind of synchronising the loop, in case we have slightly messed up the timing.

Loopers have their own rabbit hole, when it comes to buying one.
 
When I had researched loopers, I had come across feature called "quantize".

Appearently not all loopers have it.

Basically it helps create clean loops by kind of synchronising the loop, in case we have slightly messed up the timing.

Loopers have their own rabbit hole, when it comes to buying one.
Loopers are invaluable tools. My first one was a BOSS RC-1 (Black edition).

It was dead simple to use, built like a tank (as is typical with BOSS pedals :-) , and sounded solid, with a decent amount of recording time. I love the simple, easy to view circular display that tells you exactly where you are in the loop. I wish all loopers had that feature.

I used it to record this piece for a friend who was killed.

This was a piece I needed to get out of my system. I wanted to make it perfect and add all these layers and parts, but Rich Merril, a local trumpeter I met through Bandmix, agreed to lay down a track on it, and.

After hearing his work on it, I stopped wanting to do anything more with it, and I recall having tears in my eyes when I heard it for the first time, as he emailed the track back to me, with his input on it.

I never touched the piece again, after that. In my mind, it was done (mistakes and all - and there were plenty of them, mainly sloppy timing - on my part) and I was thankful to have been able to have someone work on it with me. That is a collaborative musical experience I'll treasure for the rest of my life.

The looper is used in the mid section of the song, where I played lead fills over it. There are numerous trumpet fills, throughout. He knew exactly what I was looking for and I think it really transformed the song in a powerful way - enough for me to put the song away and let it just be what it was.

I'll be forever in his debt for being kind enough to do this for me.

Loopers are great for just working out chord structures and lead lines, on your own, and hearing the sum product, live, as you play, without having to use fancy, involved recording equipment to do it.

They're also very useful, at the beginning of the chain, if you're testing out a new pedal or pedals, and if you've already recorded dry-unaffected passages (lead lines, chords, or whatever) into the looper and you're dialing in sounds on the new pedals, to see if you can dial in something that floats your boat, without having your hands full of guitar!
 
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"Might sound good, but hasn't got anything to do with the voicing I used." Really? Not anything?

No, not anything. As you may have noticed, in all 3 voicings there's an E as the top note. That's absolutely crucial for this progression to work. And because of that, your alternatives will fail.

The same notes is quite a lot and much more than nothing.

No. I'm talking about a "voicing" and not about a "chord type". And your voicings have nothing to do with mine.

It is not relevant to me whether or not certain chord voicings can only be played with a capo, because I don't play with a capo so that question is too far down on my list of priorities to consider.

So why are you even arguing in this thread? I mean, it's all fine, but I have no idea why you at least seem to be trying to prove something to me. I'd say that I know my way around chords pretty well - and I do know them particularly well enough to realize that some voicings simply can be played without a capo. And those very voicings is what capos are about for me. Sure, they also serve some laziness purposes (as in "uh no, don't wanna play barre chords in Cm all the time so let me rather slap a capo behind the 3rd fret"), but that's at least not what I'm using them for. I use them explicitely *because* I want to explore some certain voicings that would be otherwise impossible to play. So even just attempting to tell me about possible alternatives is pretty much a waste of time. None of them represent the same voicings but those very voicings are the reason for me to use a capo in the first place.
You don't have to like capos. You can never use them. I'm *absolutely* fine with that. But please don't tell me there's alternatives to what I want when there very, very clearly aren't any.

And fwiw, it's sort of like telling an MD that instead of the E-G-C open position triad you were asked to play that you'd rather play G-C-E around an octave up in 12th position - because it's the same chord! Expect that gig to be your last one.
 
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I've never understood why vibrato was every referred to as tremolo.

Leo was absolutely brilliant, but he got that one wrong.

He even got it wrong on both guitars and amps. The Vibrato system in Fender's guitars is called tremolo and the tremolo in their amps is called vibrato.
And as this had a pretty much historical impact on electric guitarists (and not even just them), I have actually seem the terms being mixed up in professional musical scores.
 
No, not anything. As you may have noticed, in all 3 voicings there's an E as the top note. That's absolutely crucial for this progression to work. And because of that, your alternatives will fail.
OK i can put the E on top if you prefer.

Crucial to who? Only to you.

You are not my teacher, so you cannot fail me or my alternative chord voicings.
E add 4 - D add 9.jpg

Did you write this progression and arrangement of chord tones or is it written and arranged by someone else? Because you seem to be very adamant about having it played one way and one way only?
No. I'm talking about a "voicing" and not about a "chord type". And your voicings have nothing to do with mine.
Yes I established that we were talking about voicings and not chord types a few posts back.

I am not working for you, so the chord voicings I use won't be the same as yours. You may not prefer the chord voicings I use, and I may not prefer the sound of your chord voicings.
So why are you even arguing in this thread? I mean, it's all fine, but I have no idea why you at least seem to be trying to prove something to me. I'd say that I know my way around chords pretty well - and I do know them particularly well enough to realize that some voicings simply can be played without a capo. And those very voicings is what capos are about for me. Sure, they also serve some laziness purposes (as in "uh no, don't wanna play barre chords in Cm all the time so let me rather slap a capo behind the 3rd fret"), but that's at least not what I'm using them for. I use them explicitely *because* I want to explore some certain voicings that would be otherwise impossible to play. So even just attempting to tell me about possible alternatives is pretty much a waste of time. None of them represent the same voicings but those very voicings are the reason for me to use a capo in the first place.
You don't have to like capos. You can never use them. I'm *absolutely* fine with that. But please don't tell me there's alternatives to what I want when there very, very clearly aren't any.

And fwiw, it's sort of like telling an MD that instead of the E-G-C open position triad you were asked to play that you'd rather play G-C-E around an octave up in 12th position - because it's the same chord! Expect that gig to be your last one.
If you believe I am trying to prove something to you, you are overestimating your importance. I am just responding to replies, questions and requests for examples that I have gotten on this thread from both you and other members. That's cool that you want to use a capo to explore diffrent chord voicings. I just choose to work without a capo. My telling you about alternative voicings is not to encourage you to use these alternatives. It is to respond to your question and requests for examples about how I would play an E add 4 and a D add 9 without a capo. You posed a question and I answered with 3 diffrent versions of the chord and now with a 4th version with the E on top.

An MD? A musical director? Honestly the example about an open chord at the 1st fret and another chord inversion an octave higher at the 12th fret is another exaggeration.

I would choose not to work for a bandleader or musical director who told me I had to use a capo. Or uses exaggerated examples of why not to do it a certain way. Or someone whose 1st message to me is jumping in the middle of my conversation with another member with the knee jerk response "Sorry, but that's almost absurd." That indicates a lack of listening skills and lack of communication skills.

A boss needs to trust in his employee's training and experience and allow some leeway on how they do their job. I have never been given music that requires a capo and have never been asked or told by a musical director or bandleader to use a capo. If you feel none of the 4 voicings I offered are sufficient, then that becomes micromanagement. If I was told I must use a capo. I would complete that day and the following day I would politely give the bandleader/music director 2 weeks notice so he could find someone to replace me.
Sorry, but that's almost absurd.
 
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You seem quite kind and reasonable.

I'd do what you do and follow your instincts and inclinations. You can play with a Capo,
or not. You can even put it in a different place than others do. Great arrangers and producers
are constantly shifting the key a song was originally recorded in and moving it to a new key
for a different feel or vibe.

There's really no rules... especially from those with narrow-minded preconceptions about
how we should play, and what tools we should or should not use.


:cheers

Thank you. Very well put. :beer
 
OK i can put the E on top if you prefer.

Crucial to who? Only to you.


Dude, seriously, you seem to delberately refuse to understand.

There's voicings you can only play with a capo. Period. No matter which "alternatives" you come up with.

You are not my teacher, so you cannot fail me or my alternative chord voicings.

I never did that, not even once. And yet, they are not the same voicings. Besides, using the open A string as an add4 shows you don't seem to know about things such as "low interval limits", so most of what you've posted seems rather academical (otherwise, feel free to post an audio example).

Did you write this progression and arrangement of chord tones or is it written and arranged by someone else? Because you seem to be very adamant about having it played one way and one way only?

It's by me. But I still want it to be played *exactly* like that.
In addition, I have been running in situations when I just had to play a specific voicing. Sometimes requiring a capo. Situations in which you would've likely been fired in case you refused to use a capo.

An MD? A musical director? Honestly the example about an open chord at the 1st fret and another chord inversion an octave higher at the 12th fret is another exaggeration.

No, it's not exaggerating at all. Your voicings sound just as different from mine. Some even sound pretty bad to my ears (such as the one using the open A string as an add4)

I would choose not to work for a bandleader or musical director who told me I had to use a capo.

Maybe that's one of the reasons why music is my profession but not yours.

A boss needs to trust in his employee's training and experience and allow some leeway on how they do their job.

You very, very clearly have never played, say, a musical. You get a sheet of notes and play them. Period.

If I was told I must use a capo. I would complete that day and the following day I would politely give the bandleader/music director 2 weeks notice so he could find someone to replace me.

You would be laughed at. At best.
 
And fwiw:

so you cannot fail me or my alternative chord voicings.

This would need no muted open string (which makes the chord kind "unstrummable") if you played it like that:
Amaj9.jpg

It would however in either case very likey be perceived as a sort of open sounding Amaj9 (or Amaj7sus2, if you will). The open A string would likely be below the low interval limit and rather make it sound like an A chord with the 5th in the bass. In fact, this is a very typical voicing for an Amaj9 chord.

Similar things go for the next chord:
A6sus4.jpg

Not only isn't that an Eadd4 by any means (most importantly there's no major third and there's also a F#, hence a 9th), but due to the pretty low A note, it likely won't sound like an E chord as well but again like an A chord. And again, in fact this is a very popular voicing for an Asus4 chord (with an additional 6th), often written as D/A (because that's what it actually is).
 
I don't understand the weird obsession some very good guitarists have with delay either.

For me it's not an obsession by any means but something I just like to have at my disposal, especially for leads. It creates a pseudo-room-ish sound and some width/depth (even in mono) and it also does great things when you hold a note/chord and add a little vibrato (using your fingers or a whammy bar). Results in a modulated delay effect with a very "natural" flavour to it, as the modulation is coming from your hands.
Really, if there was one single effect I wouldn't want to live without anymore, it's gotta be delay (fwiw, overdrives are no FX for me as they are part of the base sound).
 
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