Cheap light tube amp as modeller power amp?

[CakeEater]

I recently did this for my Helix because I felt I was spending too much time tweaking amp models, trying impulse responses and playing around with bias, high cuts, low cuts and everything else that you can get sucked into.

So to get around it I bought myself a Supro Keeley Custom 12. It's a very simple tube amp 112 combo with bass, treble, volume, and master volume. No reverb, no tremolo, no multi-channel switching or anything else that makes it more complex or weighs it down. Just a very simple 25 watt class A tube amp with a Creamback in it.

Honestly, I'm so happy, it's made my life so much simpler. Everything just sounds good and it's effortless to make it sound 'right', because it is what I've been trying to emulate. I spent some time tone matching it with the Supro in the Helix, the 112 Creamback cab and an EQ, and I got quite close but there's something in the real amp that's just livelier, more dynamic, and naturally fuller. My FRFRs, which are very good, just sound anemic by comparison.

Plus it's only 18 kilos and the master volume makes overall volume very manageable. So now I'm thinking about selling my two "FRFR" wedge monitors and using the money to fund a second Supro Keeley Custom 12. That way I can continue to run full stereo and have all the benefits of tube pre-amps, tube power-amps, and real guitar speakers. I also have the aesthetics of real tube amps with nice tolex and grillcloth which means something to me too.

If that's how you're feeling, save yourself the trouble, a good pedal platform amp is almost as flexible as a real modeler anyway. Best of luck with this and I hope you find what you're looking for.

 

[Achilles]

My FRFRs, which are very good, just sound anemic by comparison.

Eventually, everyone using full range monitors with their guitar will figure this out.

The best speaker for guitar tone is a speaker designed to reproduce guitar tone.

Go figure.....

 

[Jarick]

Eventually, everyone using full range monitors with their guitar will figure this out.

The best speaker for guitar tone is a speaker designed to reproduce guitar tone.

Go figure.....

I can get a great clean tone, especially the big 80's style with tons of stereo effects, through studio monitors. Getting a great high gain tone seems a lot trickier. Any EQ issues are amplified, especially in the high and low end.

 

[FuzzyAce]

The best speaker for guitar tone is a speaker designed to reproduce guitar tone.

Go figure.....

Perhaps... but there are many guitar speakers that aren't very good either lol.

 

[ucnick]

Also; 15 watt tube power amp is going to be gross. Better to have more power and not need vs. the opposite.

Mo' headroom, mo' bettah...

 

[ucnick]

Side note... Both the Peavey 20 micro head and the Boogie are loud as hell when cranked. 20W in tube power are really loud.

True dat.

When I was with an ABB trib band some years ago I used a Marshall DSL40C 1x12 combo amp, it could be run in either 20W or 40W power mode, and I found 20 watts was more than loud enough. The guys used to complain I was way too loud at 40W.

I also have a Marshall Origin 50 head I used a lot at outdoor gigs before I purchased my PS-100 and Quilter TB202, I would run it at half power setting (20W?) and it was loud, even at an outdoor venue.

 

[Sedaxel]

Does anyone tried or know the DV Mark powered cab 112-60? I´ve read good things about it... loud and light (8.6 kg), while being an actual guitar cab/speaker.

 

[Sedaxel]

Well, I found a cheap Fender Champion 50XL (160€ shipped) and got it to make tests.

I'm not interested in the amps pre, or its digital modelling either. I just want it as a power amp and real guitar speaker for stage monitoring with my modeller.

Power seems enough for stage monitoring. It's a 50W class D amp, and the speaker is a Celestion Midnight 60. It weighs approx 9kg.

Made some NAM captures of the preamp of my Mesa Boogie Studio .22+ and played them direct into the aux-in of the 50XL. A little care with levels, since the aux-in has no master control, it's always max power...

And the result is fantastic, so far. Just some EQ to mimic the Boogie built-in five band EQ, and there We go. Maybe it's too early to say it, but at least at home levels, this setup is absolutely great. It feels like my amp, it's approx half the weight, and it's really cheap.

It's loud. If you feed the 50XL with a healthy signal from the modeller, it can get really monstrous. And it still has some improvement margin. The speaker is decently efficient (96 dB) and lightweight (2.5 kg). But with a neo speaker, like a Jensen Tornado, you can even go louder (98.5 dB efficiency) and lighter (2 kg).

For the moment, I'm not feeling the need to upgrade the stock parts. I feel it's lightweight and loud enough.

I think this way of amplifying modellers is really interesting!

 

[Byrdman]

@Sedaxel I have the Stageright version of the HB Tube 15. I use mine at practice and it's plenty loud for a monitor. You may want to elevate it a little or angle it up since it sits close to the ground. I have it set up just like this at practice and I'm right next to our drummer and I can hear myself fine. YMMV

 

[Sedaxel]

@Byrdman, yeah... I've been looking at that amp. It can be found very cheap.

What made me go other way are some little things like:

Weight. The SS route is easy to go down to 9 kg, which is a couple kg lighter.

Speaker. The Midnight 60 seems to be more regarded than the Seventy 80.

Simplicity. This one is still to be seen... But theoretically the SS option is simpler, with less need of maintenance (tubes, biasing...).

The look. This is subjective, but I find cooler too have a black Fender look rather than a clear coloured tolex Harley Benton one.

But yes, that 15W tube amp was (and still is) on my radar. Also the Laney Cub12, which supposedly is the model that Monoprice and Harley Benton has "knockoffed". I know that 15W tube power is more than enough for my monitoring needs, since my amp is a 20W tube one, and the loudness difference is supposedly marginal.

 

[Sedaxel]

Today I spent some time playing with the 50XL built-in tones, out of curiosity.

Clean channel is very good. Perfectly useable. Actually, if I had to go for a Fender clean tone, I'd maybe use this channel instead of a model.

The Sims channel is nothing to sing about, though. It's maybe ok for noodling around at home when you just want to plug-in to the amp and start playing... But honestly, any current modelling platform, even the cheapest, is going to be more pleasant.

But as I said, for me the hidden gem of these kind of amps is the one that very few people talks about: to serve as a powered cab for modellers.

 

[Byrdman]

But as I said, for me the hidden gem of these kind of amps is the one that very few people talks about: to serve as a powered cab for modellers.

I play my Stomp XL into my DSL100H & SC20H in the return a lot and it sounds great and loud...
Just go ahead and get a bigger tube amp and a good cab, you will thank me in about 6 months

 

[Sedaxel]

I play my Stomp XL into my DSL100H & SC20H in the return a lot and it sounds great and loud...
Just go ahead and get a bigger tube amp and a good cab, you will thank me in about 6 months

I already have it! I'm very happy with my Mesa Boogie Studio .22+. The problem is that it weighs nearly 20kg (it's approx 18 kg) and, even when it's still portable, it requires force to grab it and walk with it against the leg. When you have to walk some distance (from the car to the stage, some stairs, etc), it's not comfortable. I didn't mind at first... But I've had back problems, and I'm not fully recovered. So started to use a little modeller direct to PA, with floor monitors. But the experience on stage is not the best... And that's why I'm starting now to think about a real cab for the modeller. This is all this thread is about.

 

[Sedaxel]

is 10/10 at home…but at a gig I always was a bit less enthousiastic.

Yeah... This is what I'm still not convinced about this setup. I guess I'll only know when I try.