Bad sound guys: The bane of digital guitarists

[JiveTurkey]

FTFY.

It you want to sound like anemic shit; yes. I'm sure the convenience is great though.

 

[Sascha Franck]

It you want to sound like anemic shit; yes. I'm sure the convenience is great though.

In all seriousness, when there's some house stuff already, I sometimes really only need some additional monitoring. And believe it or don't, that 30y old G&K vocal amp with its 2 6" speakers, with nothing but the mids really working anymore, is the perfect addon to make me cut through. I try to get a balanced overall sound with the house stuff and only turn the G&K up until I start hearing it.
Sometimes I need to move it around a bit (likely due to phase issues), but once I find a good spot, the sound is surprisingly nice that way.

And fwiw, I also seem to prefer 10" over 12" wedges, the latter often being a tad boomy, unlike you EQ them, something I try to avoid unless really needed.

 

[jay mitchell]

I'm gonna get really unconventional here and go back to the OP.

By his own account, metropolis_4 is willing to use a modeler and send a direct feed to the PA system. Also by his account, he's come to terms with IEMs, something I've never attempted nor intend to attempt. Additionally, he says he was happy bringing a relatively large and heavy combo amp (AC30) and a pedal board.

The issue in the OP is that he is not happy with the mix and his sound in the monitor. That being the case, the solution I proposed to him in my earlier post will work just fine: bring your own wedge. Place it in front of you next to the house-supplied monitor. Your objection that it doesn't "balance" naturally is irrelevant. The wedge you bring isn't there to "balance" with the other instruments; that is the responsibility of the sound guy and the house PA. The wedge you bring is there so you can hear yourself. Same as with IEMs. There are a number of quality powered wedges that are smaller and lighter than an AC30, which you say you don't object to carrying. If your present low-budget wedge isn't adequate, you have the option to upgrade. A better wedge will still cost and weigh less than an AC30.

 

[metropolis_4]

Your objection that it doesn't "balance" naturally is irrelevant. The wedge you bring isn't there to "balance" with the other instruments; that is the responsibility of the sound guy and the house PA. The wedge you bring is there so you can hear yourself.

I think you misunderstood what I mean about the sound balancing because I do think it is relevant.

If I’m hearing all the other instruments through mics and monitors then my direct guitar tone of a mic’d speaker also through a monitor sits just fine. The sounds blend well and sit well with each other.

But if I’m hearing the other instruments acoustically in the room but I’m hearing myself direct through a monitor it sounds incongruous to me. The sounds don’t blend or sit well together and it bothers me.

It’s become one of those things I just have to deal with, but I wish I could find a better solution.

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

I think you misunderstood what I mean about the sound balancing because I do think it is relevant.

If I’m hearing all the other instruments through mics and monitors then my direct guitar tone of a mic’d speaker also through a monitor sits just fine. The sounds blend well and sit well with each other.

But if I’m hearing the other instruments acoustically in the room but I’m hearing myself direct through a monitor it sounds incongruous to me. The sounds don’t blend or sit well together and it bothers me.

It’s become one of those things I just have to deal with, but I wish I could find a better solution.

Totally agree.
Stage sound is simply different then foh sound….and to blend in…you need to adapt.
A drumkit at foh mixed by todays standards is pretty scooped….on stage it’s a midrange monster you have to compete with…requires different sound.
Which also debunks the “I wanna hear what the audience hears”….you actually don’t cause the band sounds very different on stage then in foh.(typical pop band btw…acoustic/jazz should be different story)

In my mind the solution is a cab

 

[Sascha Franck]

But if I’m hearing the other instruments acoustically in the room but I’m hearing myself direct through a monitor it sounds incongruous to me. The sounds don’t blend or sit well together and it bothers me.

Use an acoustic guitar then.

 

[jay mitchell]

If I’m hearing all the other instruments through mics and monitors then my direct guitar tone of a mic’d speaker also through a monitor sits just fine.

That is the direct equivalent of the scenario you described in the OP: a modeler with a close-mic'ed IR through a monitor. But then you said about that:
"I’m only hearing myself out of a wedge monitor buried in the mix of the rest of the band so half the time I can’t even hear what I’m playing. And my tone is mixed so thin and bright it sounds like complete and I hate it."

IOW, the sound guy's mix, combined with his EQ of your signal, is producing a result that you find unsatisfactory. So bring your own wedge for guitar only, place it next to the house wedge, and set your level and EQ so as to produce a balanced sound in combination with the mix in the house monitor. That's really not difficult....

 

[Sascha Franck]

That's really not difficult....

Apparently it is. He's possibly not getting the A-I-T-R sound (oh yeah, let's open that can o' worms again!).

 

[JiveTurkey]

In all seriousness, when there's some house stuff already, I sometimes really only need some additional monitoring. And believe it or don't, that 30y old G&K vocal amp with its 2 6" speakers, with nothing but the mids really working anymore, is the perfect addon to make me cut through. I try to get a balanced overall sound with the house stuff and only turn the G&K up until I start hearing it.
Sometimes I need to move it around a bit (likely due to phase issues), but once I find a good spot, the sound is surprisingly nice that way.

And fwiw, I also seem to prefer 10" over 12" wedges, the latter often being a tad boomy, unlike you EQ them, something I try to avoid unless really needed.

I do LOVE me some productive down-sizing. I get that 1000%

 

[metropolis_4]

That is the direct equivalent of the scenario you described in the OP: a modeler with a close-mic'ed IR through a monitor. But then you said about that:
"I’m only hearing myself out of a wedge monitor buried in the mix of the rest of the band so half the time I can’t even hear what I’m playing. And my tone is mixed so thin and bright it sounds like complete and I hate it."

IOW, the sound guy's mix, combined with his EQ of your signal, is producing a result that you find unsatisfactory. So bring your own wedge for guitar only, place it next to the house wedge, and set your level and EQ so as to produce a balanced sound in combination with the mix in the house monitor. That's really not difficult....

Yes, you’re right. In the scenario I mentioned in this OP that would work. Like I said, when the other instruments are also coming direct through the monitors it works. When they’re not it doesn’t.

 

[ian_dissonance]

There is one way you don’t have to worry about what the band is doing to have consistent monitoring…