Atomic Tonocracy (Inc NAM support)

[Ed DeGenaro]

I this why I have to set the buffer in Tonocracy to 3 or 4 times higher compared to other amp sim software? It still low enough to be not a problem but on complex presets it would give little blips of noise if I don’t bump it up.

I run it on the minimum…

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

hmm I thought I set the speaker compression thing to 0 but i’ll double check.

EDIT: Yep, Speaker compression was at the default value. Good catch - turned it off and re-uploaded:



A properly captured model shouldn't need any additional speaker compression IMO. 99% of the time its doing more damage than good, for my tastes.

I like it way more with some because of the sqish factor.

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

After using the software more, my gut feeling is that the product would have been stronger if (to begin with) it JUST focused on the capturing tech.

If it was $40-50, and was ONLY a plugin+standalone software for making Tonocracy captures with the existing tech/system, as well as for playing Tonocracy and NAM models.

If it features:

- Simple guided process for making models
- Levels automatically calibrated and stored as metadata
- Cloud training with queue system for sets of captures
- deep and easy to use system for entering metadata
- a cutting edge, smart browser for both finding AND organising both NAM and Tonocracy models (with the ability to add/edit metadata)
- user pages for the cloud, ability to search users, save as favourites, add as friends, share privately, "llke" etc
- Beautiful and simple UI with minimal clutter
- Continued support for OS updates, different DAW's, iOS/tablets etc


IMO that is a much clearer and more concise product, and it would entice a TON of users that haven't delved into NAM - either because of the need to work at different sample rates, who don't want to use Colab or manually process files, or who prefer having a company that offers support and updates rather than an open source platform. Its at a price that competes with what ToneX typically sells for and would improve a ton of aspects that users do not like about that ecosystem.

I think that could be built up and developed to support IR's in a slick and elegant way, then perhaps adding software to help create IR's (in the same way that it walks you through making captures).

I think when that is in a good spot, that can be incorporated into an all singing, all dancing behemoth plugin that does it all. Releasing that first would have bought more time to make more amp models/fx/cabs etc and made both feel more complete. Just personal opinion here, but I feel like with plugins its more often than not makes sense to fragment the software into smaller and cheaper blocks that are concise and THEN offer the do it all one. With HW units, its a little different because the HW has to perform the routing functions of the DAW, the I/O of the interface etc. Its working with totally different constraints.



At the same time, I also feel like the amp modelling side of Tonocracy would benefit from a similar level of focus. As it stands, the lines are pretty blurry between the modelled amps and the captures, and IMO the modelled amps SHOULD be the flagship. The GUI's should look the ABSOLUTE BEST they possibly can, and should visually match the pride and devotion thats gone into the modelling. The amp models should at least be on pair with what the competition offers, with amp modes and channels in the same UI, a dedicated modern cabinet section, (hopefully) the ability to match the poweramp/impedance behaviours with the loaded cabinet. If there is a limited amount of pedals, I don't think complex internal routing is THAT important - its so easy to route things in a DAW, and I think a vast majority of users are more than happy to just have guitar->pre FX->amp->cab->post FX. I think when there is a deep selection of FX and amp models to combine, the appeal of more complex routing becomes greater, but I think its a risky feature to add as it can bloat software up.

I also think it a massive oversight of the plugin to not support right clicking at all. Simple things like locking parameters, saving as default for blocks, copy and paste, MIDI learn, favourite etc could live in there.

Likewise, on the signal routing section, I would MUCH prefer to just right click somewhere on the line, and a contextual dropdown menu appears with categories with say:

- Amplifiers - > List of amps
- Captures -> Tonocracy
-> NAM
- FX -> Drives
-> Modulation
->Delay
->Reverb -> IR's -> HW Units -> Plates
-> Halls etc
-> Physical Units
- Cabinets -> Tonocracy
->User IR's

At any one point in time, I could be looking at the list with almost everything I am NOT looking for. The list on the left could be so much smarter if it was more contextual, had a search feature, tags, metadata, colours, graphics, deeper info etc. There are small graphics next to the name of each item in the list, but for instance the graphic for captures and algorithmic models are almost identical. And when looking at text, one could be a delay, one could be a capture, one could be a cab. This is where colours, graphics, context dependency all help you find what you are looking for faster and more elegantly.

Similarly, this:View attachment 13360Feels like such a waste of screen estate. All but 2 of the knobs are duplicated, and seeing both at the same time just looks odd and unnecessarily awkward to focus on. The numerical value could be displayed as a pop over the knobs, there could be an option for Skeu/flat design in preferences, deeper controls could be hidden or using a different type of knob to distinguish them.

Similarly, this is a user captureView attachment 13361

and this is an algorithm based model of a TOTALLY different amp:

View attachment 13362

Our brain is automatically going to assume that the modelled amps are some kind of extention of captures, or maybe some sort of factory captures. Or maybe they just seemed like something added last minute reusing some UI elements. It doesn't make the algorithm modelled stuff SEEM like its the proudest achievement of cutting edge technology when its presented like this. The same is true for the JTM45, 1959 and BE100 all sharing the same UI elements.

Collapse the second panel. Theres an icon i think middle right for it.

 

[Enchilada Jones]

I run it on the minimum…

It's strange, with most amp sims or any audio software I can run near the minimum but with Tonocracy I get the brief but regular 'blip' of a noise. Running the higher settings...low 300's or above gets rid of the noise and doesn't seem to be a problem with latency. Plays fine, records fine, no issues. I just wondered if this was typical. My laptop is a 13" 2017 MacBook Pro 3.1 GHz Dual-Core Intel Core i5.

 

[ericbr1]

It's strange, with most amp sims or any audio software I can run near the minimum but with Tonocracy I get the brief but regular 'blip' of a noise. Running the higher settings...low 300's or above gets rid of the noise and doesn't seem to be a problem with latency. Plays fine, records fine, no issues. I just wondered if this was typical. My laptop is a 13" 2017 MacBook Pro 3.1 GHz Dual-Core Intel Core i5.

15" mid-2012 MacBook Pro 2.3 ghz quad core intel core I7 . . I've been running the Tonocracy demo at 48000 Sample rate and 32 samples/buffer and it works 100% great with no noticeable latency and no noises.. . Is yours now working in your Logic? Or are you getting that noise using it as a 'standalone' app? Mine's still only useable as a standalone

 

[Enchilada Jones]

Stand alone
i shall dig deeper
i have other devices plugged into usb, and forgot to disconnect them. Never needed to before but now I know it shouldn’t need that buffer so high I’ll track it down

i did get it to load in logic by manually enabling the plugin where the plug in manager had identified it as unverified or something like that but haven’t been using it that way in days

 

[ericbr1]

Stand alone
i shall dig deeper
i have other devices plugged into usb, and forgot to disconnect them. Never needed to before but now I know it shouldn’t need that buffer so high I’ll track it down

i did get it to load in logic by manually enabling the plugin where the plug in manager had identified it as unverified or something like that but haven’t been using it that way in days

Mine still says 'crashes validation" on Logic, and Ilok Manager problem with GarageBand, so there's no way to manually plug it in. I just downloaded a Neural Dsp Tim Henson 14 day trial last night and that worked perfectly in Logic and GarageBand instantly, so I'm pretty sure I know how to do it! lol. . Oh well

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

It's strange, with most amp sims or any audio software I can run near the minimum but with Tonocracy I get the brief but regular 'blip' of a noise. Running the higher settings...low 300's or above gets rid of the noise and doesn't seem to be a problem with latency. Plays fine, records fine, no issues. I just wondered if this was typical. My laptop is a 13" 2017 MacBook Pro 3.1 GHz Dual-Core Intel Core i5.

I run it on a lowly 2019 imac

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

Mine still says 'crashes validation" on Logic, and Ilok Manager problem with GarageBand, so there's no way to manually plug it in. I just downloaded a Neural Dsp Tim Henson 14 day trial last night and that worked perfectly in Logic and GarageBand instantly, so I'm pretty sure I know how to do it! lol. . Oh well

Did you trying to just validate it in logics plugin manager?

 

[ericbr1]

Did you trying to just validate it in logics plugin manager?

OH yea. Doesn't work . . Maybe it's because it's the Demo version, as Enchilada Jones manually validated his after it didn't plug-in ,but he has the Paid version. . No other software has this issue though. All my other demos I tried in the past 3 years had 0 issues with ILOK License MGR, or being AU's in Logic or GarageBand, and this one shows up ,but then can't be enabled in either program. Otherwise, Enchilada Jones is on a newer system, so might have a newer version of Logic Pro or Garage Band, and even though the Tonocracy is compatible with Mac Catalina 10.15 maybe it's not fully compatible with my Logic Pro /Garage Band versions. . . I'm patiently awaiting a reply

 

[mavrick102000]

Not sure if I'm doing something wrong. Sounds a little off. Running through Helix as interface on a blank preset. Input gain of 11.5 dBU on the plugin.


Input gain settings are nice, but I'm just not feeling it even with the captures.

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

It's strange, with most amp sims or any audio software I can run near the minimum but with Tonocracy I get the brief but regular 'blip' of a noise. Running the higher settings...low 300's or above gets rid of the noise and doesn't seem to be a problem with latency. Plays fine, records fine, no issues. I just wondered if this was typical. My laptop is a 13" 2017 MacBook Pro 3.1 GHz Dual-Core Intel Core i5.

My update i just checked on my lowly 2019 imac its 12% load at 16 samples. No hiccups.
It might be a demo vs. Full thing.

I seen this with ndsp their demos hiccup my machine the full doesnt. Or if logic serves it might be an ilok thing, dunno.

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

OH yea. Doesn't work . . Maybe it's because it's the Demo version, as Enchilada Jones manually validated his after it didn't plug-in ,but he has the Paid version. . No other software has this issue though. All my other demos I tried in the past 3 years had 0 issues with ILOK License MGR, or being AU's in Logic or GarageBand, and this one shows up ,but then can't be enabled in either program. Otherwise, Enchilada Jones is on a newer system, so might have a newer version of Logic Pro or Garage Band, and even though the Tonocracy is compatible with Mac Catalina 10.15 maybe it's not fully compatible with my Logic Pro /Garage Band versions. . . I'm patiently awaiting a reply

I just updated Logic to 10.8 and the full version validated without going in the plugin manager.
But i did have some stuff before that just kept crashing validation, which usually is no biggie since most if my stuff i do in Nuendo.

 

[ericbr1]

I just updated Logic to 10.8 and the full version validated without going in the plugin manager.
But i did have some stuff before that just kept crashing validation, which usually is no biggie since most if my stuff i do in Nuendo.

can't put Logic 10.8 on my operating system, but still this is the only plugin out of dozens I've tried that doesn't work. Logic Pro 10.6.3 is the highest you can go on Catalina 10.15.7, and Catalina 10.15.7 is the highest you can go on this type of MacBookpro. This computer is incredible for everything, but not for Tonocracy I guess at this point. Bummer

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

can't put Logic 10.8 on my operating system, but still this is the only plugin out of dozens I've tried that doesn't work. Logic Pro 10.6.3 is the highest you can go on Catalina 10.15.7, and Catalina 10.15.7 is the highest you can go on this type of MacBookpro. This computer is incredible for everything, but not for Tonocracy I guess at this point. Bummer

So its like my 2013 mbp.
I haven’t used it with the release but ran it during beta and that was no issue with Logic. With obviously doesn’t help you.

 

[ericbr1]

So its like my 2013 mbp.
I haven’t used it with the release but ran it during beta and that was no issue with Logic. With obviously doesn’t help you.

Yes this is the mid-2012 model that was always rated great for everything. It has a SS Harddrive, a massive backup drive, and lots of speed. It's been by far the best computer I've owned including much newer stuff. . Never has a problem on anything (until this.. wellllp)

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

Yes this is the mid-2012 model that was always rated great for everything. It has a SS Harddrive, a massive backup drive, and lots of speed. It's been by far the best computer I've owned including much newer stuff. . Never has a problem on anything (until this.. wellllp)

I might pull out mine tomorrow (if i can stop shedding long enough) and see how it plays with the current version.

 

[eggpl@nt]

Agreed. I tried the demo today, and this would be a much more compelling product (to me) if it was 1/3 to 1/2 the price and focused more on the Captures and NAM integration.

Quoting myself because...

Check your inboxes, ya'll. Tonocracy sent me an invite to complete a survey for 50% off (if you are one of the first 100 respondents). I was and I bit for $80. This is price I thought was more aligned with the value this program offered to me.

 

[mikah912]

Quoting myself because...

Check your inboxes, ya'll. Tonocracy sent me an invite to complete a survey for 50% off (if you are one of the first 100 respondents). I was and I bit for $80. This is price I thought was more aligned with the value this program offered to me.

No such luck for me, but I JUST won a Tonex Max license anyway that I'm just getting around to setting up (been too busy playing/recording with the new Helix update on Native).

I'm going to keep my eye on the product though....feels like it could really be something with a bit more polish and attention to UX.

 

[DrewJD82]

I might pull out mine tomorrow (if i can stop shedding long enough) and see how it plays with the current version.

Don’t you normally shed in the warmer months? I thought it was getting colder in your area.