Amplitube 5

[MirrorProfiles]

BRIT 9000 / JCM 900 MKIII?

I know there are several threads about grumbling about IK and AT5 about various (and valid) topics, but there's a few things I still really like Amplitube for that I believe warrant some positive discussion (and maybe get overlooked because of the negative stuff).

I was thinking recently about the Brit 9000 model that was introduced in version 4.

I've only ever owned a JCM900 4100 and never paid too much attention to the other models in the JCM 900 line, nor this particular emulation. The manual strongly suggests this model is the more-common 4100 Dual Reverb Model. If you look more closely at the controls available though, it seems to be based on (probably) the "High Gain Master Volume MKIII" version of the JCM900 (notice "preamp volume AND sensitivity" and just a single channel).

The Dual Reverb model has a single gain control for each channel:

The SL-X also shares the same controls as the Mark III, but the difference between them is that on the SL-X, setting the "sensitivity" knob to 0 means you'll have no voltage going across that gain stage and therefore no sound. On the Mark III, it just means you won't be clipping, so you'll still get sound coming through with that control on 0.

To get a similar amount of preamp gain as this video:

I have to max out the input level slider (after providing a 11.5dBu input), and its still a little undergained compared to the video. That said, it sounds a HELL OF A LOT better like this, and both preamp controls have a way more effective and useful range. Well worth a try.

There is also a "British Tube Lead 2" model which is older - I can't tell if its a looser emulation of this same reference amp, or whether this one is the JCM 900 4100. The manual suggests they are both the 4100, but the Brit 9000 almost certainly seems to be the MKIII to me.

Being the wanker that I am, I went digging through some of IK's photos of their amp collection (and previous and current studios). I really wish there was some cool gear porn shots, because IK really have an ASTOUNDING amount of cool amps and especially cabs. I couldn't find anything with this JCM 900 in unfortunately.

If we haven't totally frightened @IK Multimedia off from posting here besides new product announcements, it would be awesome if you're able to share anything from IK's stash.

I'll add more posts of other cool stuff I like in AT5 later

 

[MirrorProfiles]

GEAR PORN

 

[MirrorProfiles]

AFD SLASH

The AFD Slash model is another one that feels undergained, even with something like a -3dBu input level. Again, I've never played the real thing so I can only go off youtube videos and emulations from other companies that provide accurate input levels (Mercuriall, Fractal, some NAM models). Would be rad if anyone with the real amp can compare their amp's amount of gain and help other users to get a closer approximation on what to do

 

[Rocco Crocco]

Just popped in to say the MiniPlex 20 (Dirty Shirley?) in Amplitube kicks ass. I never played a real one, but I like this best of all the Marshally options in A5.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

MiniPlex 20 (Dirty Shirley?)

PT20 V1





Cool amp that I don’t believe has been modelled anywhere else. But also, one of the cheaper built Friedman’s that’s maybe less desirable/more attainable to most.

I think AT5 has a solid collection of stock Marshalls - several 1959’s, JTM45 and 100 (Hendrix), 2203 (I think more than one), Jubilee (slash and silver), AFD100, JVM410HJS, JMP-1, Major. They could probably add an 18W, Super Bass and some modded ones and call it a day. Only downside is the question mark over input levels.

They also have a really solid variety of Marshall cabs and appropriate speakers (that are well captured, multiple speakers, several mics). The Slash cabs have some great sounding V30’s.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I spent some time with the Fender/Dr Z/Vox/Lone Star yesterday. I’d found some of these models a little limp and a lot of them are amps I have never played so I have no frame of reference what to expect.

I started by setting the amp gain to max, and then adjusted the input slider until the gain seemed like what I would guess it would be (total stab in the dark because I’ve never played these amps).

My opinion on a lot of these amps improved a TON, they suddenly feel less dull and more lively.

I really wish @IK Multimedia would provide more specific values for input gain because it sucks having to guess what the real response is. I can get cool tones from them but it’s not really a 1:1 emulation until the gain is right.

For some reason I can imagine down the line Amplitube will adopt some kind of “hybrid” approach using some ML tech from ToneX - if this is the case, I really hope they unify their input headroom’s across the board and give very specific values and guidance on it. Furthermore, they should unify the input levels on their interfaces to the same headroom. They could even have the interface communicate with the software to automatically adjust for pads or different gain levels.

It’s probably my second biggest wish, behind IK overhauling their customer service and upgrade policy to something more fair and similar to other companies with a proper support structure.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Input set at 11.4dBu of headroom.



To get the amount of gain in this video, even with the input slider at +15dB I'm still undergained.

I used this video as a guide for the Thunderverb 200:



and with some proper input boost I could get closer.

These amps make a ton of sense with the correct input level, the circuit comes alive and you have various tones at your mercy based on where the gain control is. If you feed it a quiet signal, you aren't getting ANY of the intended sounds.

 

[Elric]

AT5 is kind of a mess, IMHO. A lot of substandard stuff in there to sift through. Generally not worth it, compared to Native, Neural, STL, Mercuriall, others, although not everything sucks...

As others have noted, levels are a problem, gain sounds/levels are a problem, etc.

Pick it up on a group buy deal or as a freebie with hardware or something rather than paying full price for it.

 

[Bob Zaod]

I love AT5 mostly but if I were to add a complaint, I'm disappointed I can't use their cab engine thingamajig to make IR's.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

AT5 is kind of a mess, IMHO. A lot of substandard stuff in there to sift through. Generally not worth it, compared to Native, Neural, STL, Mercuriall, others.

Its frustrating because on the whole its got good (and sometimes great) technology lurking in it - its just IK that shoot themselves in the foot with the experience the user gets.

RANT IMPENDING

I'm just doing a small video right now to show how inconsistent these gain levels are. It seems OCD, but when you have a DI that is nearly clipping, and boosting another 15dB still gives an undergained result, then its demanding a hell of a lot of knowledge from the user on what its supposed to sound like and how they're meant to achieve it.

Lets remember a key feature of the current version. OPTIMIZED INTERNAL GAIN STRUCTURE.

The manual has literally one sentence on input levels

If they mentioned things like how hard to strum, and what kind of pickups to account for, it would still be totally useless and lacking in detail. But this is particularly vague when its literally the most critical aspect of getting a tone. The other thing is that some amps need over 15dB of calibration to sound correct, while others are fine. The user is simply expected to know what every single amp in the plugin is supposed to sound like and adjust themselves.

Also, remember that the input slider may need to be adjusted a particular way for a specific amp or pedal or ToneX model. If you swap those out, then you may have to readjust again. If you are combining models, then you better get your abacus out if you want anything close to realistic tones.

I'm going to try and showcase the AFD100 and ENGL E650 too, which I also believe have serious input gain issues (meaning I need to boost more than is possible in the plugin) compared to what the real amps have. Ill also include some amps that don't need as much adjustment.

IK are constantly adding more bloat and confusion to Amplitube and ToneX. That goes for their interfaces using wildly different amounts of headroom for instruments and reamp levels. That goes for a lack of information on their own ToneX captures, and specs for the ToneX pedal.

Amplitube 6 needs to seriously look at resolving and simplifying things so that there is one internal reference level for ALL of their products, with no ambiguity, guess work, or detective work needed from their customers. Remove the bloat, and confusion.

As it stands, IK are yet to even acknowledge that there *might* be a problem with their software in this regard. Anyone sane would have abandoned IK already and recommended others do the same - plenty of people do that, but I actually believe the product would be a hell of a lot stronger if they just sort this out.

BTW, there is lots that I like about Amplitube but its hard to focus on the good aspects when the basic stuff is such a mess.

 

[Whizzinby]

RANT IMPENDING

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Quick video thrown together to demonstrate the issue of Amplitube's input gain structure. If you record a DI which is just below clipping, and you still have to boost over 15dB of gain to have an amp sound CLOSE to right (its still undergained), then perhaps there is a larger issue here? Why on earth is it like this?



The video was boring enough as it was but there are many other amps in there that this is true for.

 

[Rocco Crocco]

Quick video thrown together to demonstrate the issue of Amplitube's input gain structure. If you record a DI which is just below clipping, and you still have to boost over 15dB of gain to have an amp sound CLOSE to right (its still undergained), then perhaps there is a larger issue here? Why on earth is it like this?



The video was boring enough as it was but there are many other amps in there that this is true for.

Just finished watching. Someone should post this to Peter IK at the other place to see what he has to say about it.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

He might say something along the lines of:

"IK has many professional users and beta testers, and our products get signed off by officially endorsed partners. The models have nothing wrong, otherwise we would have been told in development before they were released to the public"

 

[James Freeman]

Laughably undergained.

The level adjustment instruction all plugin manufacturers are giving is such bullshit.

 

[James Freeman]

OPTIMIZED INTERNAL GAIN STRUCTURE.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

The Slash Booster pedal is a clean level boost with no harmonic or EQ colouration and a 20dB range (yes, the slash amps fall in the category of the amps needing an enormous input boost).

 

[MirrorProfiles]

MARK IV

This model is excellent IMO, a very good representation of the real amp and POSSIBLY my favourite on any platform when all things are considered (price, GUI, features, sound, plugin etc). One important thing to consider is for some reason they made the knobs go from 1-10 rather than 0-10:

so you have to factor in that difference when setting things up if you are familiar with the real thing.

As far as input level goes, the amp is capable of a very wide range of tones so you may find it less fussy. It also makes it a bit harder to determine the correct level. I do feel at 12dBu or so, its a bit undergained. Going closer to 0dBu seems more appropriate but until IK clarify, WHO KNOWS?

Some quick tones with an input headroom of 11.4dBu and the input trim on the plugin set to 12.2dB:

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Using my 11.4dBu input, I just put a maxed out Slash boost in front of the entire Fender 1 Collection, and then added another dab or so more on the input trim.

It certainly gets things much closer (as in, they sound and feel like amps now) but there’s probably room to push a bit more. Worth trying if you have them because it’s quite a nice selection of amps.

 

[paisleywookiee]

This was a lovely thread over at TGP