Why the hard heads might be wrong about Blackstar modeling

[KingsXJJ]

First of all the Dept. 10 pedals are hybrid. One part is analog with a tube preamp and another part is post processing (cab, mic, axis, ambience, post EQ, power amp tube type, resonance, presence and master volume).

If you can deal with adjusting those variables you might just be surprised. If, on the other hand, you want plug and play with less options, look at the Revolt, Iridium or Simplifier DLX.

 

[sleewell]

Allrightythen

 

[KingsXJJ]

Allrightythen

Just trying to add some context to my Revolt observations. Not trying to sell anything.

Since the very first time I played a Blackstar 5 watt combo, I heard something I thought was missing from the Marshall equivalent. A smoothness and refinement while still retaining the basic character we all recognize as Marshall. Some might argue that missing element was necessary for stage performances and live mixes. I don’t feel that way.

I think the Blackstar engineers that left Marshall were on to something. I wonder what @santiall opinion and knowledge about this is. I recall him speaking about product development and having to hit certain price and performance envelopes. I wonder how much this is involved in the equation versus simple performance goals.

 

[JiveTurkey]

My Blackstar journey:

Bought an HT100wtfever. Sounded bland no matter where the INF knob was set. Sold it. Looked at other things as stories of bad reliability hit combined with the fact that they don't provide schematics or have authorized service centers last I looked. So basically it's a marginal amp that can't get repaired if it shits the bed. I don't have the energy to prove myself wrong with anything by them. Other than the St. James and that would have to be sub fire sale for me to give it a go.

 

[KingsXJJ]

My Blackstar journey:

Bought an HT100wtfever. Sounded bland no matter where the INF knob was set. Sold it. Looked at other things as stories of bad reliability hit combined with the fact that they don't provide schematics or have authorized service centers last I looked. So basically it's a marginal amp that can't get repaired if it s***s the bed. I don't have the energy to prove myself wrong with anything by them. Other than the St. James and that would have to be sub fire sale for me to give it a go.

Ok, but… entirely different product line and technology involved. They snared the initial investors with tube based pedals after winning NAMM awards. They are back again with said pedals loaded with a gear heads wishlist. At half the cost. Like I said, hard heads…

 

[JiveTurkey]

Ok, but… entirely different product line and technology involved. They snared the initial investors with tube based pedals after winning NAMM awards. They are back again with said pedals loaded with a gear heads wishlist. At half the cost. Like I said, hard heads…

guilty as charged

 

[santiall]

Just trying to add some context to my Revolt observations. Not trying to sell anything.

Since the very first time I played a Blackstar 5 watt combo, I heard something I thought was missing from the Marshall equivalent. A smoothness and refinement while still retaining the basic character we all recognize as Marshall. Some might argue that missing element was necessary for stage performances and live mixes. I don’t feel that way.

I think the Blackstar engineers that left Marshall were on to something. I wonder what @santiall opinion and knowledge about this is. I recall him speaking about product development and having to hit certain price and performance envelopes. I wonder how much this is involved in the equation versus simple performance goals.

I guess there are two different schools of design, you call it refinement, other people would say the amps are 'soft' and dark. It depends on the application, probably for playing at home they sound 'nice and round' but in a mix or in a band context you'll miss the roughness of the 'unpolished' amp.

The circuits that the Blackstar people designed when they were in Marshall also followed that same style of design of rather complex designs with plenty of filtering here and there, multiple clipping and filtering stages and so on. I guess that philosophy is somehow to make the amplifiers sound closer to how an amplifier sounds after recorded and produced but the more you polish that tone, the less flexible the amplifier ends being.

I am of the opinion that many people will hear 'holy grail' unproduced guitar recordings and they'll think that those guitars sound absolutely horrible which is tricky because if you design an amp to sound in certain way after recorded it'll probably sound nasty when just connected to a cabinet and even nastier after just recorded with an SM57

As for cost, it is more a development cost than a circuit cost. At the end few resistors, capacitors and operational amplifiers in the pcb will add a couple of dollars, but the 5 months you will spend to polish that circuit are expensive...

 

[la szum]

My Blackstar journey:

Bought an HT100wtfever. Sounded bland no matter where the INF knob was set. Sold it. Looked at other things as stories of bad reliability hit combined with the fact that they don't provide schematics or have authorized service centers last I looked. So basically it's a marginal amp that can't get repaired if it s***s the bed. I don't have the energy to prove myself wrong with anything by them. Other than the St. James and that would have to be sub fire sale for me to give it a go.

So, this one experience is enough for us all to draw universal conclusions from?? That's not very scientific.

Blackstar is part of Korg and are serviced through their global network of warranty and service providers. FYI.

 

[JiveTurkey]

So, this one experience is enough for us all to draw universal conclusions from?? That's not very scientific.

Blackstar is part of Korg and are serviced through their global network of warranty and service providers. FYI.

So you own the Lovepedal Co and Blackstar! I knew something was up!

 

[la szum]

I guess there are two different schools of design, you call it refinement, other people would say the amps are 'soft' and dark. It depends on the application, probably for playing at home they sound 'nice and round' but in a mix or in a band context you'll miss the roughness of the 'unpolished' amp.

Great post! That perfectly describes my experience with Friedman amps versus the vintage/iconic Marshall amps
I have owned and played. I also have had a few Blackstar amps (still own 2) and those are less refined and rawer
sounding (but not as raw and as unpolished as the Marshalls) than the Friedmans are. The Friedmans are great,
but just a little to smooth and polished sounding. For me.

 

[la szum]

I am SO doing one of the Weekly Challenges with only the Blackstars just so you can all over it.

 

[la szum]

So you own the Lovepedal Co and Blackstar! I knew something was up!

No one scrapes the bottom of the gear barrel like I can.

 

[JiveTurkey]

I am SO doing one of the Weekly Challenges with only the Blackstars just so you can all over it.

Do it! I will listen and I will LIKE IT!

 

[JiveTurkey]

Great post! That perfectly describes my experience with Friedman amps versus the vintage/iconic Marshall amps
I have owned and played. I also have had a few Blackstar amps (still own 2) and those are less refined and rawer
sounding (but not as raw and as unpolished as the Marshalls) than the Friedmans are. The Friedmans are great,
but just a little to smooth and polished sounding. For me.

So which Blackstar heads do you have? The brurple tolex one, right? What else?

 

[la szum]

I would be proud if I were you, JT, you have yet another Thread Title in your honour.

 

[la szum]

So which Blackstar heads do you have? The brurple tolex one, right? What else?

Burple. My favourite colour!

 

[la szum]

Series one 200watter with 6550s. It's as if a Marshall JCM800, an Orange Thunderverb 200, and a Mesa Mark Series
had a baby.

At least that is what I tell myself.

 

[la szum]

Burple is also one of my fave Marijuana Strains.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Series one 200watter with 6550s. It's as if a Marshall JCM800, an Orange Thunderverb 200, and a Mesa Mark Series
had a baby.

At least that is what I tell myself.

Not gonna lie. That sounds very appealing. And possibility a sterilization tool

 

[Bob Zaod]

First of all the Dept. 10 pedals are hybrid. One part is analog with a tube preamp and another part is post processing (cab, mic, axis, ambience, post EQ, power amp tube type, resonance, presence and master volume).

If you can deal with adjusting those variables you might just be surprised. If, on the other hand, you want plug and play with less options, look at the Revolt, Iridium or Simplifier DLX.

Man I wish I'd have known about those months ago. I however now have OD pedals that absolutely tick all boxes for me but am still tempted to try one of the Blackstars. The HT Dual sp? I used to have was great.