What's preventing you from getting a Helix Stadium?

[Sascha Franck]

Features like Showcase are "you didn't know you needed this" type stuff. I don't see any usecase for it myself, but I think it's cool tech that might work out for many when they figure out how it can work for them.

I'm not denying that. And yet, wouldn't you expect them to focus on features people have been asking for at first? I would.

Line6 is running into the same issue as Fractal. When you already have hundreds of effects and amps, where can you truly go?

Well, it's kinda known that many L6 FX aren't exactly something to write home about (which is quite different to Fractal, IMO at least).

Quirky effects are of little interest to most users. They try them a few times, think it's cool, but can't think of an actual usecase for it.

While I like some quirky FX myself, I can perfectly understand that these aren't priorized at all.
But there's other FX that aren't all that quirky and still not exactly *there* in the L6 universe. For instance, try to get a smooth touch wah/filter such as in the NDSP John Mayer plugin. It's almost impossible unless you couple it with some EQs and compressors. Heck, an MS-50G does them better (it also does quite some FX better than the L6 offerings, IMO at least - it's why it'll see a return on my board). And we've already "dissected" their rotary offerings. Which are just horrible (sorry L6, but it is what it is...). That's some FX plenty of players are actually using. And these are just two. IMO there's a reason their delay modeler pedal got quite famous but their modulation modeler didn't.

To me the Helix Stadium seems so easy to use that mobile editors become largely irrelevant.

Well, being mainly a live player, I defenitely disagree. I'd love having a mobile editor, ideally featuring a "performance mode" page, so I wouldn't have to bow down for last minute adjustments. Let alone you could as well do crazy stuff, such as utilizing the XY pad in a Kaoss Pad manner - nothing you'd want to do while crawling on the floor.

We are only a few months from Stadium XL's initial release. I agree it's a bit more work-in-progress than I thought, but I fully expect there will be a lot of issues solved by summer if Line6 keeps the pace of major updates every 2-3 months.

I don't exactly disagree with that. But still, their priorities are making me scratch my head.

 

[Sedaxel]

I hate to say this, but I was expecting a new market leader... and it hasn´t been so. At least, not currently.

I feel similar to when TMP appeared with its almost 2k price.

Now, it´s L6 who goes over 2k, but with a device that isn´t the best out there... neither in tones nor reliablility, and with still missing features.

I´m not in the market for another multifx, but if I was, I wouldn´t remotely choose the Stadium in this moment.

First reason: price.

Second: still no capturing feature.

Third: the effects are not my cup of tea.

Fourth: the amps are not on par with the best (which for me are QC and FAS).

What I love of the Stadium is all the innovtion and potential it has. I owned a Helix LT and loved the UI and functionality. And L6 are a really friendly and responsive company, usually updating their devices quite frequently and for a long time. So I´m sure it will be up there with the top dogs, but I guess it still needs a couple years.

 

[EOengineer]

I hate to say this, but I was expecting a new market leader... and it hasn´t been so. At least, not currently.

I feel similar to when TMP appeared with its almost 2k price.

Now, it´s L6 who goes over 2k, but with a device that isn´t the best out there... neither in tones nor reliablility, and with still missing features.

What “reliability” issues do you think Stadium has?

 

[jellodog]

I personally was attracted to the smaller Stadium device. If they'd released that first then I may well have caved.

But then the AM4 was released. I know it's not an Apples to Apples comparison, but regardless, I bought the AM4 and my Stadium GAS evaporated.

I like the smaller, more compact modellers.

 

[PorcinePicker]

My interest in the Stadium platform was primarily the “all-in-one” potential to automate a show. I don’t need that right now, but I have a project in mind that could really benefit from it eventually.

The main thing that deflated my ardor was the mixing of Agora with the old Helix models. JMHO, but if you’re going to have a new platform, go all in. I know that including “legacy” stuff is a long tradition for Line 6. It always struck me as chaotic and confusing. With the amps, it feels half baked.

The bugs are a buzzkill, but would just delay jumping in, not stop it permanently.

 

[Orvillain]

It always struck me as chaotic and confusing. With the amps, it feels half baked.

Why?

 

[Sascha Franck]

I know that including “legacy” stuff is a long tradition for Line 6. It always struck me as chaotic and confusing.

What's so confusing in case the legacy stuff is labeled properly?
I really welcomed the addition of the legacy FX back then, prefered quite some of them over newer offerings.
Might be the same with some amps.

 

[SillyOctpuss]

I had order for xl but canceled…I think in a year they will have things sorted

 

[Lysander]

But then the AM4 was released. I know it's not an Apples to Apples comparison, but regardless, I bought the AM4 and my Stadium GAS evaporated.

NGL, the AM4 had me seriously doubting my HXS purchase when it dropped out of nowhere. It's the device i really wanted back when i bought a FM3... for a second time

 

[Rewolf]

I am almost certainly in the 0.01% of users, and perhaps an exception here because Showcase is something that could be really useful to me.

I would like new FX on the lines of the EH xxx9 series, or the IOS App MIDI Guitar 2 to avoid some current latency with running USB “FX Loops” via an iPad Pro, but that is not critical - what I have works.

The deal breaker for me is the lack of support for my JTV-69

 

[EOengineer]

My interest in the Stadium platform was primarily the “all-in-one” potential to automate a show. I don’t need that right now, but I have a project in mind that could really benefit from it eventually.

I had originally bought Stadium hoping to use showcase and all those cool tools for a project that naturally folded prior to all that stuff coming to fruition in Stadium. Now all I have are these stupid amp models!

 

[Jarick]

Honestly I just feel like the market is over saturated. As so many people have gone digital in the last decade to me there’s only two real reasons to buy something new:

1. I need to solve a specific problem

2. I’m bored and want to buy something new

Financially I’m tapped out so boredom can’t drive big purchases for me anymore. Even then I’m really feeling burned out on the constant churn of new gear and YouTube ads and everything.

Stadium doesn’t really solve any problems for me so it won’t drive a buying decision. It looks cool but I have two flagship modelers already not to mention boxes full of pedals and other gear.

Maybe it’s projecting my burnout but I really wonder if new gear in general will not be selling well. There was so much gear purchased since 2020 that flooded the used market and I bet a lot of that was bought on credit that’s piling up.

 

[Sedaxel]

What “reliability” issues do you think Stadium has?

Well, actually not sure. I think I read something about finicky wifi... but being completely honest, maybe I was just getting it wrong. I don´t know.

 

[jellodog]

We are at the start of product cycle that will last a few years; so even though I didn't buy one this year, I would never rule out picking one up sometime. It looks to be a really cool device.

I didn't even buy an Axe-Fx III until 6 years after release. And I didn't buy an OG Helix until 1.5 years after first release.

Plenty of time to have another go on the merry-go-round in the future.

 

[dbfretz]

Still feels like the previous gen. I think they made a mistake with the naming and prioritising things like Showcase when what they needed to do was serve the guitar player first. Extensive amps, new effects and captures.

 

[EOengineer]

Still feels like the previous gen. I think they made a mistake with the naming and prioritising things like Showcase when what they needed to do was serve the guitar player first. Extensive amps, new effects and captures.

LMAO. Dude joined an hour ago to make their first comment shitting on Stadium.

 

[Mongillo19]

LMAO. Dude joined an hour ago to make their first comment shitting on Stadium.

 

[Lysander]

...when what they needed to do was serve the guitar player first.

The more i browse forums, the more i realize most guitar players don't know what the fuck they want HXS ticks basically every box people have been complaining about Helix (and modelers in general) for years, only to be received with "eh, i guess we wanted... more?"

Now, it might not be the device for you and that's fine - there's plenty of amazing competition out there. But i can't help to scratch my head reading comments of "bad tones", "no reliability", "lacks effects", "meh amp models" or "no captures" (!!!) - particularly from some who apparently have never used one.

I'm stoked about getting a non-XL HXS myself. It's pretty much the golilocks small-Helix-without-exp-pedal i've been waiting for years, and the *only* thing which gave me some pause was the launch price. But that ship has sadly sailed for the entire industry; see f.ex. the Quad Cortex Mini, which some here rave about, and is only 20% cheaper than HX Stadium Floor.

 

[Orvillain]

Man, that Agoura Revv Red is fucking sick. No question.

 

[mikah912]

LMAO. Dude joined an hour ago to make their first comment shitting on Stadium.

I mean...that's the only reason for this thread to exist, right? People need a place to LiveJournal their gripes with Stadium and/or Line 6.

Honestly, @Jarick hit on the biggest obstacle in my opinion: This is a mature niche market with a good amount of competition. The SaaS company I do marketing for grapples with the same problem, and all of our messaging now is focused on "replacements" or how easy and advantageous it is to switch from your existing system to ours.

Additionally, the economy sucks and disposable income isn't abundant for a lot of people.

The grumbling about FX and amp selection or whatever is tertiary to this reality. Most of these gripes were never going to be addressed at launch, and Line 6 did a pretty good job of keeping expectations of a slew of all-new content in check from the moment they announced it.

Where I do think they erred - and they would probably agree given how they changed up their practices very shortly after launch - was that this launched with an insufficiently diverse pool of alpha and beta testers. So something as elemental as weak WiFi connection stability never appeared on their radar because - by their own admission - they connected to it just fine in all of their testing environments.

So now, they're actively trying to expand the beta testing pool, and (leaks of new content aside) that's probably a very good thing. Once these quality-of-life bugs are fully squared away, the Stadium Floor is fully launched and Proxy is made available in the next month or two, I see a pretty smooth runway for true takeoff for the platform.

But they're still going to run into the reality that it's relatively pricey, and competitors like Fractal and NDSP are releasing their new hotness in the lower and mid-tiers. For myself, I have zero regrets and it's served me well. I miss a few things about the content on my FM9, but nothing to make me want to use anything but Stadium as my main rig for the foreseeable future.

Playing the Agoura models is a blast with the best feel I've ever experienced in a modeler. Using the UI is the best user experience I've ever had in a modeler. I don't see anyone snatching the crown from Line 6 on either front for quite some time.