What is the most complex tube amp ever made?

Desertdweller said:
Just seeing this now and while I can see the point I also know there are a few guys out there, myself included, that swear by the RK2. Here’s why:

I. All the best of the recto sounds.

IIA. The ability to play fully saturated at bedroom volumes. The RK2 sounds better at bedroom levels than even the Mini Rectifier and Rectoverb 25. It’s not even close. You’d think the lower wattage amps would do this better, but no.

IIB. There is magic to running 6L6s and EL34s at the same time. You can only do this on a handful of amps. The orange channel in Modern especially is insanely rich sounding in this config.

IIC. Tweed mode. The clean modes are the Lonestar cleans but still sound pretty basic. Both clean and fat need a treble boost or compressor circuit up front to sound right. Tweed mode though, my lord it’s so good. Running it in full headroom 120w mode with all the power tubes pushing it is just a sound you have to play.

IIC+. Channel-specific diode modes. The clean channel and vintage mode in the higher gain channels sounds great with tube rectification, while you can set higher gain modes to silicon rectification. Yes you can do this on the MW recto as well, but not on earlier models.

IIC++. Brit mode, very misunderstood, but if you set the amp to spongy mode instead of bold, use the EL34s only, run the gain and bass dimed, and hit it with an SD1 out front, you have a JCM 800 in your Road King. It’s incredible for 80s rock and metal sounds, and you’d have to switch out the power tubes to do this on the Roadster.

IV. The pedal for it is so ridiculous it scares other players from trying to play your amp without asking you first.

V. It just sounds better than all other rectos I’ve owned. I’ve had 7 or 8 rectos now and the one I’ve kept is the RK2.

VII. Yes it’s heavy, but it’s 55 lbs and still marginally smaller than most Marshall and Randall heads.
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The Road King is literally the same amp as the Roadster, the RK just has a second effects loop and the cab switching with the ability to mix and match tubes on each channel, so all but your IIB point here is possible on the Roadster. I thought the tube mixing was cool, but not cool enough to warrant the extra price tag. I generally prefer all Rectos with EL34s and the Roadster can use EL34s. The footswitch for both versions of the RK only have 1 more button, for the second FX loop. The Roadster is an absolutely killer amp that can typically be found for stupid prices on the used market now. For some reason, they are not as sought after as the 2 channel, RK or the MW, and you can often find them in the US for the same price as a 3 channel, which is a awful amp in comparison.
 
Ed DeGenaro said:
And as much as the idea sounds Great it needed serious modding so it didn’t feel like you’re dragging your pick through a sponge.
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Interesting but understandable, though sponginess should be controllable via levels and reducing bass early on?

That said, I have never played one.
 
The main issue I had with RK is the promise of versatility whilst offering none. A one sound amp with a lot of switches and knobs.
 
Eagle said:
The main issue I had with RK is the promise of versatility whilst offering none. A one sound amp with a lot of switches and knobs.
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You’re highly opinionated, prone to hyperbole, apparently not too bright and have the social skills of a hermit.

You speak in absolutes that have no basis in an objective reality and spout them as universal truths. But I’m sure you heard quite a few observations along these lines numerous times before.
 
KingsXJJ said:
You’re highly opinionated, prone to hyperbole, apparently not too bright and have the social skills of a hermit.

You speak in absolutes that have no basis in an objective reality and spout them as universal truths. But I’m sure you heard quite a few observations along these lines numerous times before.
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Based on knowledge and experience and 35 years a full time technician in this industry. I don’t advertise and am permanently busy. You on the other hand are qualified to comment how exactly?
 
Eagle said:
Based on knowledge and experience and 35 years a full time technician in this industry. I don’t advertise and am permanently busy. You on the other hand are qualified to comment how exactly?
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My life experience. Wisdom is knowing your perspective isn’t necessarily universal and speaking accordingly. Life 101 type shit if you’re fully functional.
 
KingsXJJ said:
My life experience. Wisdom is knowing your perspective isn’t necessarily universal and speaking accordingly. Life 101 type shit if you’re fully functional.
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So you mean nothing and no clue , the RK was originally marketed as a versatile product offering a wid range of Mesa tones including from the MK series. It simply doesn’t . It is actually a four channel recto end of and not even the best sounding version of that. This is not a matter of opinion it is just fact . If you like recto tone maybe it’s for you but I got it in a trade and wanted it to do more than one thing multiple times.
Mesa at the time also had terrible support in the UK ( Westside distribution) no decent amp tech and sent stuff they couldn’t do back to the factory with a six month turnaround.
I presume this is fixed now though Gibson.
 
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If we allow preamps ;
IMG_4184.jpeg

The X99 is a good candidate. I have swapped out tubes in this one a few times.
All tube all analog signal path. I’m not sure any of the other midi preamps managed that beyond switching between pre existing channels.
 
If you don't like the Diezel sound, then no amount of tweakery is going to make you fall in love with a VH4. Personally, I do love it. My VH4 is one of my lifer amps, even if I do blend it.

But likewise with my Mark V. Which is my most used amp for the last 9 months or so of owning it. I'd call it my favourite.

My 6505+ I barely touch to be honest, even though it is really frickin' cool.

In terms of complex amps.... it has to be something like the Mark V or JVM. Those things are really whacky in terms of the amount of relay control going on, on the inside. Diezel VHX is probably no slouch in that department either!
 
Orvillain said:
If you don't like the Diezel sound, then no amount of tweakery is going to make you fall in love with a VH4. Personally, I do love it. My VH4 is one of my lifer amps, even if I do blend it.

But likewise with my Mark V. Which is my most used amp for the last 9 months or so of owning it. I'd call it my favourite.

My 6505+ I barely touch to be honest, even though it is really frickin' cool.

In terms of complex amps.... it has to be something like the Mark V or JVM. Those things are really whacky in terms of the amount of relay control going on, on the inside. Diezel VHX is probably no slouch in that department either!
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“The main issue I had with RK is the promise of versatility whilst offering none. A one sound amp with a lot of switches and knobs.”

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Hi all, the most complex amp I have ever owned (was ever made?) is a Revv Generator 120 MkIII. I have previously had JVM410's which are considered a complexity benchmark, but the JVM is simple compared to the Revv.
  • Four Channels, each with their own full EQ: Blue (clean: Bright & Wide options); Green (Crunch: 3 Drive Modes + Bright Option); Purple (Distortion 1: 3 Aggression modes + Bright, Cut & Fat Options); and Red (Distortion 2: 3 Aggression modes + Bright, Cut & Fat Options)
  • 2 switchable Master Volume controls, global Presence and Depth controls
  • Onboard reverb & noise gate
  • Midi control of all channels & modes
  • Takes just about any octal power tube or combination of pairs (!!): 6L6, EL34, KT88, etc., (currently 5 x 12Ax7 + 4 x 6L6)
  • External bias test points & relatively easy bias adjustment
  • Two notes stereo Torpedo-embedded virtual cabinet 6-position rotary selector, volume control, and headphone output jack + Bluetooth control
  • Switchable internal cabinet load
  • Switchable 120/10 watt power output
Front Panel: 25 knobs, 13 buttons (2 are dual purpose) & 2 switches, lots of coloured LEDs to let you know where you are
Rear Panel: 2 knobs (reverb level & gate threshold), 6 buttons, 2 x XLR outs, fx loop, USB, cab light din plug, midi in, through & footswitch

There has been some very clever work done by Revv to ensure that there are no level jumps between drive modes in the same channel (I'm looking at you JVM).

Luckily, I get very useable tones with all knobs close to 12.00, which makes things less visually confusing.

All of these options would mean nothing if the tones weren't stellar - they are.

Also, the Revv takes effects pedals very well - the clean channel with a Friedman BE OD Deluxe in front really scratches that 'Modded Marshal' itch (largely missing from the Revv, which seems to have its own unique voicing).

As I only really use 7 core tones (Clean, Grit, Crunch 1, 2 & 3 and Lead 1 & 2) and will run a GT1000 for effects and midi control, I plan to set the Revv up as 'set & forget'. But first I need to know what EL34's and KT88's will sound like .....

Cheers!
Paul
 
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