NDSP Quad Cortex

[AFKAEjay]

well once they have the plug ins ported over I will be interested to see the frequency of the updates they should be adding content at a much faster pace and since some of the fx lack maybe that’s where they will focus their efforts
At launch their modulation effects were horrible but they did come up with new chorus and flanger engine blocks
Maybe as Leon Todd said a delay engine is in the cards

Seems there is a “circular” delay in the books for the next release…that does sound like something that should be able to do what I’m after…

I could imagine that they are not all that motivated to update their efx…cause it might canabalize their plug-in sales,..

 

[Whizzinby]

well once they have the plug ins ported over I will be interested to see the frequency of the updates they should be adding content at a much faster pace and since some of the fx lack maybe that’s where they will focus their efforts

The thing is while 3.0 adds plug-in compatibility on the QC, it’s not really the finish line for plugins if only 4 of them are actually portable. So as much as we’d like to look at 3.0 as the finish line, they still have another 18 or so plugins to update. Considering the X updates between the first two and the second two is looking to be about six months, I don’t think all the plugs are going to be ported until well into next year or beyond.

They may not be able to “focus their efforts” anytime soon. (Which may or may not matter depending on if you own some of these plugs or are planning to buy them once available, they may serve as paid update for anyone that gets bored)

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I have a feeling that when users are finally able to load up the models from their plugins, they’ll realise it’s not as bigger deal as it sounds. It’s just an easy marketing thing to grab a hold of that sounds like it’s a great idea.

Being able to run a Cortex Native is 100000000% more appealing than running plugins on the cortex, the whole discussion of running plugin models on the HW is such a backwards way of looking at it IMO.

 

[GTR37]

Seems there is a “circular” delay in the books for the next release…that does sound like something that should be able to do what I’m after…

I could imagine that they are not all that motivated to update their efx…cause it might canabalize their plug-in sales,..

Agreed on your last point
If they can sell you something they will

 

[laxu]

The thing is while 3.0 adds plug-in compatibility on the QC, it’s not really the finish line for plugins if only 4 of them are actually portable. So as much as we’d like to look at 3.0 as the finish line, they still have another 18 or so plugins to update. Considering the X updates between the first two and the second two is looking to be about six months, I don’t think all the plugs are going to be ported until well into next year or beyond.

They may not be able to “focus their efforts” anytime soon. (Which may or may not matter depending on if you own some of these plugs or are planning to buy them once available, they may serve as paid update for anyone that gets bored)

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe only the older plugins need these "X updates" because they are built on an older architecture. Newer plugins might be compatible, or they might get compatibility updates faster.

I have a feeling that when users are finally able to load up the models from their plugins, they’ll realise it’s not as bigger deal as it sounds. It’s just an easy marketing thing to grab a hold of that sounds like it’s a great idea.

That's how I felt 3 years ago already. To me e.g a computer editor was more important, even though that wasn't necessary either because the onboard UI was so nice to use for everything but content management. It would have just made for local backups and less shitty content management.

Had NDSP blabbermouths never advertised plugin compatibility they could have just said "no, it's too complicated for licensing" or "no we just don't want to do it".

NDSP already had to redact some of their product page advertising leading to release or quickly after it because they would have probably been blamed for false advertising otherwise. But they did sell a lot of preorders with the premise of all those features. They were able to fudge some of that by providing captures rather than amp models.

If they release a Cortex Native (seriously, they are going to rip off that name too?) plugin, that would make sense because they have already oversaturated the market with all those Archetype plugins so probably the sales figures from any new ones don't look as good unless they can attach some really big name to it. Wouldn't be surprised if NDSP give QC owners a discount on the plugin too like Line6 does.

NDSP plugins are already priced at levels that don't really appeal, as the prices have gone up from 99 € to 119 € for most plugins. That 99 € mark was IMO pretty crucial. By comparison e.g ML Sound Lab is still in the 40-99 € range because they can keep that easier as a 2 person company vs NDSP with 50+ people.

 

[Whizzinby]

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe only the older plugins need these "X updates" because they are built on an older architecture. Newer plugins might be compatible, or they might get compatibility updates faster.

Yeah they need to be X to be portable and so far they’ve only done 2. (And they projected on their last update they’ll have another two done by the time 3.0 drops)

So basically they’ll have about 18 plugs to update after 3.0 drops not including whatever future plugs they drop which may or may not be compatible at release. (Their last plug-in for example, which dropped after their first X update, was not compatible at release)

 

[AFKAEjay]

Yeah they need to be X to be portable and so far they’ve only done 2. (And they projected on their last update they’ll have another two done by the time 3.0 drops)

So basically they’ll have about 18 plugs to update after 3.0 drops not including whatever future plugs they drop which may or may not be compatible at release. (Their last plug-in for example, which dropped after their first X update, was not compatible at release)

Any timelines on 3?…besides “soon”

 

[Whizzinby]

Any timelines on 3?…besides “soon”

Q2, so probably June.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

If they release a Cortex Native (seriously, they are going to rip off that name too?) plugin, that would make sense because they have already oversaturated the market with all those Archetype plugins so probably the sales figures from any new ones don't look as good unless they can attach some really big name to it. Wouldn't be surprised if NDSP give QC owners a discount on the plugin too like Line6 does.

With the naming thing, "Native" has been around long before Helix and kind of goes back to older DSP systems like Digidesign TDM, TC Powercore, UAD etc. It was commonly used to distinguish between processing on external DSP and a plugin. So even though it seems like copying Helix Native, I think its a logical word to describe something that isnt running on external DSP to the DAW.

Cortex and Helix definitely sound like they could be from the same family of products. But "Fractal" also has that "technical science" name and imagery, I think its something guitarists associate with "modern accurate amp modelling". Loads of companies lean on that, its just marketing that guitarists seem to expect.

NDSP plugins are already priced at levels that don't really appeal, as the prices have gone up from 99 € to 119 € for most plugins. That 99 € mark was IMO pretty crucial. By comparison e.g ML Sound Lab is still in the 40-99 € range because they can keep that easier as a 2 person company vs NDSP with 50+ people.

As far as I'm aware (this may have changed or evolved a bit), ML soundlab amp sims are little more than waveshapers with IR's EQ matching the tone, interpolating between settings. I've heard of some of the signature models being captured remotely by just reamping some test signals through the amp at various settings. That's not to say that they sound bad - for some amps it can be reasonably close. I remember an old forum posts that EQ matched a MT-2 to a 5150 and it was depressingly close.

But if thats the level of modelling, then I would absolutely not expect ML amp sims to be priced any more than what they are. Add official licensing from amp manufacturers or artists and the NDSP doesn't seem too unreasonable to me. Its easy for us to get used to insanely low pricing being the norm.

 

[Los-D]

I mean they could use anything else…

Cortex Core
Cortex Host
Cortex Hive
Cortex Skynet

You get the picture (and I’m horrible at marketing)

 

[Whizzinby]

I have a feeling that when users are finally able to load up the models from their plugins, they’ll realise it’s not as bigger deal as it sounds. It’s just an easy marketing thing to grab a hold of that sounds like it’s a great idea.

Being able to run a Cortex Native is 100000000% more appealing than running plugins on the cortex, the whole discussion of running plugin models on the HW is such a backwards way of looking at it IMO.

I agree they may not land as significant as we think, but let’s also consider that the initial value most people put on having them wasn’t factoring in three+ years of additional development.

Nobody’s excitement was under the premise they were the dev equivalent of building the Roman Coliseum. This was a “shortly after launch” feature.

At this point plugins have more symbolic value than anything else, but plugins have proven to be an anchor for platform.

 

[Mongillo19]

At this point plugins have more symbolic value than anything else, but plugins have proven to be an anchor for platform.

Definitely! And who wouldn't love some Grano goodness

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I agree they may not land as significant as we think, but let’s also consider that the initial value most people put on having them wasn’t factoring in three+ years of additional development.

Nobody’s excitement was under the premise they were the dev equivalent of building the Roman Coliseum. This was a “shortly after launch” feature.

At this point plugins have more symbolic value than anything else, but plugins have proven to be an anchor for platform.

Yeah absolutely. I dont really see it as a big deal myself, I can think of loads of plugins I've bought over the years that promised things that never arrived.

Steven Slate was guilty of this on MANY occaisons - he promised samples printed through Bricasti, FG-X2 took about 10(!!!) years longer than what they initially promised, longstanding bugs that never got fixed, absurd claims about how much would get added to their Virtual Mix Rack environment, promises that 3rd party plugins in their sub would never get removed (and then several cut ties). IK make all kinds of bold claims, I have Lexicon plugins that initially cost like £1000 that havent been properly updated for YEARS. URS Plugins basically turned into abandonware after charging "high end" prices, Abbey Road had some plugins that turned into abandonware.

I cant talk because I down own or see myself owning a QC but anyone who is that desperate for the amps from Gojira or Plini or SLO or Nolly already has them. Whenever its actually added itll be a massive anti climax besides some very niche cases. I think most QC users will find that adding totally new amp models or FX will be way more exciting. I genuinely dont understand the energy some non-QC users have to go on about the plugin integration, there are so many other things that would improve the QC over some promise their big mouthed CEO made. The shitty PSU is a way bigger issue IMO.

 

[GTR37]

Q2, so probably June.

I may have misunderstood and I can’t say that they are being honest but from what they have said once Pcom part is completed , it’s the plug in team that will handle the X versions and Cortex team will be able to go back to their regular scheduled program
Because someone voiced your concerns is the next 2 years going to just be X release and NDSP said no plug in updates will not affect QC development after PCOM is established
But. . Their track record of giving accurate info has never been stellar

 

[Mongillo19]

I may have misunderstood and I can’t say that they are being honest but from what they have said once Pcom part is completed , it’s the plug in team that will handle the X versions and Cortex team will be able to go back to their regular scheduled program
Because someone voiced your concerns is the next 2 years going to just be X release and NDSP said no plug in updates will not affect QC development after PCOM is established
But. . Their track record of giving accurate info has never been stellar

Hard to say. I think they've said plugins don't effect QC updates, but then they also do, but now they don't?

Who knows. The next update (after this initial plugin integration) will give us a good idea of future plans imo

 

[AFKAEjay]

The shitty PSU is a way bigger issue IMO.

What is the issue with it? Works so far…

 

[MirrorProfiles]

What is the issue with it? Works so far…

Prone to noise, the overall grounding of the device isn’t done very well. I’ve recorded them in the studio a few times and almost every time as soon as it’s powered up, something will start humming. Easy enough to fix but it’s definitely a design flaw

 

[AFKAEjay]

Prone to noise, the overall grounding of the device isn’t done very well. I’ve recorded them in the studio a few times and almost every time as soon as it’s powered up, something will start humming. Easy enough to fix but it’s definitely a design flaw

But when you use a 12v adapter….there’s no grounding from that either way is it?
Arent the issues mitigated with flipping groundlifts with the units settings?

 

[MirrorProfiles]

But when you use a 12v adapter….there’s no grounding from that either way is it?
Arent the issues mitigated with flipping groundlifts with the units settings?

I just use a line isolator and try different power outlets if I'm getting issues. I eventually get it quiet but it requires some faff

 

[Lysander]

I have a feeling that when users are finally able to load up the models from their plugins, they’ll realise it’s not as bigger deal as it sounds. It’s just an easy marketing thing to grab a hold of that sounds like it’s a great idea.

+1. Besides some notable outliers (Tom Morello and Granophyre, for exampe), pretty much all plugins are small variants on the exact same set of amps.

I think this will be way more notable on the FX side though. Once people are able to load plugins in their QCs, they will able to very easily A/B them.