Stumbled Across TGF, been using TGP. What’s the difference and why did TGF start?

[SeeD]

But "in the end" people will move on to the next shiny new box... so all this was for naught

I sure hope that folks use the `box` they like to use. That is all that matters ( at least to me )
I was never married to a product. The last 5 years I had a Axe FX II I was hoping someone was going to realese a new `box` that had profiling/capture tech, and for me the QC ticks all the `boxes`

As good as Fractal is, the QC just works better for me

 

[wharf rat]

Yeaaaaahhhhh, that’s where some of the controversy comes into play; pre-launch the CEO was on TGP bragging about how the pandemic wasn’t affecting them at all. They had already ordered all the materials needed to put the units together, they were just working on the programming and since they could do it from home, they were unaffected. But the delays kept coming and more than once, Doug stated it wasn’t the pandemic, just them trying to make it as perfect as possible.

It wasn’t until nearly a year after it started shipping that they came out with a blog update stating the issues they ran into with the pandemic, which was just getting parts to make new units. They had to figure out how to make new chips work in the unit at one point and needed to pool all the staff together to make it happen, which is why the updates have not been “aggressive” as they were promised to be.

There’s two histories now; the easily seen history in all the TGP posts where everything was going great and no issues were related to the pandemic (pre-launch) then the revisionist history that was created after the unit started shipping. For over a year the CEO was on TGP talking the unit up and handing out promises like gifts on an Oprah set, then as soon as that thing started shipping he ghosted social media and the majority of their communication is via blog posts that get run through their AI-revisionist filter.

Those of us who find the company (and their volunteers) to be slimy have often been questioned “Why does it bother you so much?”, personally speaking, I’m a gear fan. My life consists of music and very little else and is the most important thing in my life, one of the very few things I take seriously. I think the launch of this thing and the way NDSP has handled themselves sets a really sh*tty precedent where companies can release products that aren’t what was advertised and then make it up as they go along. Now we’re sitting at nearly 2 years since launch and some of their customers have taken this same mentality; covering up major issues with the unit and re-writing history.

A perfect example is the thread the OP of this thread started on TGP, asking people their thoughts on the dependability of NDSP to see the unit through to the end and if it was believed they could actually handle it. The only people who were honest and open about the issues were those who already sold the unit or have been watching from the sidelines, the majority of the owners just spit out the same BS NDSP has been or the ever-present “I like the form factor and it fits my needs” and then instead of addressing any of the issues that people brought up, questioned the legitimacy of the posters bringing up the issues. The whole attack the messenger and not the message thing that people tend to do when they’re trying avoid the point.

So the point of my OP on “the other forum” was to figure out what the deal is with the QC (popular well selling product with a large base of followers who hate it but also love it). I followed it when it was announced but dropped sync on it in the year following as I was busy doing other things. I was aware it was shipping with strings attached but I didn’t know anything other than that. When I saw a demo pop up on Sweetwater for $1500 (!!) I jumped on it.

I’m a bedroom dad who likes nice things but tries to stay within a reasonable budget. I can afford one nice modeler, but I can’t be the guy who owns an FM3, a QC, and an HX Stomp. Whatever I buy I want it to LAST. I know digital is the wrong place for that, but I also can’t do the analog stuff. It’s too loud, and pedals are an absolute rabbit hole. I’m also a perpetual intermediate beginner; I like to noodle for 30 mins a day and that’s it. I’m not ever going to gig or whatever. So I like to plug in and play; whatever I buy has to be dead simple and it will likely never leave my desk.

The Helix stuff is nice, but I’m not gonna pay $1800 for an 8 year old product no matter how many times Line 6 leadership states that it’s not receiving an update (ala Helix 2); I just don’t trust that.

Fractal seems nice but it also seems very complicated. I’m not that smart; I need a plug and play product.

Boss GT1000 Core sounded good but the interface was literally stupid.

So I took a chance at the high school dance (QC) and have been reasonably happy with the interface and LOVE the way it sounds. Form factor is nice. If I was not plugged in to these forums online I’d be unaware of any of the drama, too, so there’s that.

I’m sure NDSP is a gross company, but I’d be willing to bet that there are aspects of any of these companies that I’d be at odds with if I was aware of them, I just haven’t had the opportunity to look into it.

 

[DrewJD82]

So the point of my OP on “the other forum” was to figure out what the deal is with the QC (popular well selling product with a large base of followers who hate it but also love it). I followed it when it was announced but dropped sync on it in the year following as I was busy doing other things. I was aware it was shipping with strings attached but I didn’t know anything other than that. When I saw a demo pop up on Sweetwater for $1500 (!!) I jumped on it.

I’m a bedroom dad who likes nice things but tries to stay within a reasonable budget. I can afford one nice modeler, but I can’t be the guy who owns an FM3, a QC, and an HX Stomp. Whatever I buy I want it to LAST. I know digital is the wrong place for that, but I also can’t do the analog stuff. It’s too loud, and pedals are an absolute rabbit hole. I’m also a perpetual intermediate beginner; I like to noodle for 30 mins a day and that’s it. I’m not ever going to gig or whatever. So I like to plug in and play; whatever I buy has to be dead simple and it will likely never leave my desk.

The Helix stuff is nice, but I’m not gonna pay $1800 for an 8 year old product no matter how many times Line 6 leadership states that it’s not receiving an update (ala Helix 2); I just don’t trust that.

Fractal seems nice but it also seems very complicated. I’m not that smart; I need a plug and play product.

Boss GT1000 Core sounded good but the interface was literally stupid.

So I took a chance at the high school dance (QC) and have been reasonably happy with the interface and LOVE the way it sounds. Form factor is nice. If I was not plugged in to these forums online I’d be unaware of any of the drama, too, so there’s that.

I’m sure NDSP is a gross company, but I’d be willing to bet that there are aspects of any of these companies that I’d be at odds with if I was aware of them, I just haven’t had the opportunity to look into it.

No need to explain yourself, good sir! You’re not part of the QC-squad I brought up in my posts here and don’t seem at all like you would be.

I totally get and appreciate your reasoning, like I said in another post, I’m always stoked when someone finds gear that works for them! And more than that, I don’t WANT anyone’s QC to fail, I don’t wish for NDSP to fail either, it’s never been about that. It’s 100% about holding a company to their word and their ability to maintain the product throughout it’s lifetime, as well as not wanting to see things like this becoming a recurring pattern in the gear world.

 

[wharf rat]

their ability to maintain the product throughout it’s lifetime

+1. This is why I started that other thread.

I’m cheap. I don’t want to keep buying modelers. I want to commit $1500 and let it be good for 5-6 years.

 

[DrewJD82]

+1. This is why I started that other thread.

For sure, which is exactly why I took issue with the usual suspects sweeping things under the rug. That thread was an ideal place and time for some of those owners to discuss the issues they’ve had from a reliability standpoint, but they chose not to do so and did the “All good here, but some people really hate it for some reason” Had I not known the history myself, I’d absolutely get the idea from that thread that everyone who currently owns one has been issue-free and only the people who sold it or never owned it had an issue, which is far from the truth.

Personally, up until recently I never really questioned if NDSP would be able to see this thing through to the end. It was only when I read that corrupted captures are causing processor failures that I started questioning that. If there’s no way to know if a capture is corrupted and it can happen to anyone arbitrarily, there’s really no telling how many units could require a new processor. If I were NDSP, I’d be sh*tting my pants until it was known exactly what’s causing the corruption (curious if it’s the spotty Wifi during downloads) and a fix was enabled.

 

[the-trooper]

The whole gear wars thing is just so stupid. Look at a guy like Leon Todd or Pete Thorn. Every review they do the gear sounds amazing.

That's because they record everything through Zoom 707II, and just act like they're using that other stuff.

 

[Bruce]

Hahaha well the Vertex thing was quite different; that dude was buying BBE wah pedals, not doing a thing but changing the faceplate and rubber grip, gooping the insides and saying it was a Vertex product, then continued to lie about it after being caught. I have no doubts that all the guts of a QC were designed by NDSP, they just can’t seem to get the thing up to it’s advertised state and the longer time goes by (we’re going on 2 years now) the higher the chances of the initial features being removed/forgotten about. A lot of the customers are already saying they don‘t care about the originally promised features, lending them even more leeway to not deliver.

That’s a bummer to hear about Eventide, especially at that price point.

Hahahah and for every QC user that has their unit mounted on a board, there’s 2-3 guys that use it as a desktop unit and have a separate MIDI controller they keep on the floor…..but I believe that’s mostly due to the QC’s footswitching not offering a lot of versatility and the lack of a desktop editor; no one wants to bend over a pedalboard to program the thing. Which is also kind of funny, “UI is so intuitive and so much easier to use than other modelers…..that’s why I keep it a foot away from my hands instead of on the floor.”

I guess Im spoiled with the FAS GUIs. I really would miss them if they were less than they are, or completely non existent.

*edit* I hope I'm not the only one who now feels guilty for being a dad and owning more than one modeler

 

[wharf rat]

For sure, which is exactly why I took issue with the usual suspects sweeping things under the rug. That thread was an ideal place and time for some of those owners to discuss the issues they’ve had from a reliability standpoint, but they chose not to do so and did the “All good here, but some people really hate it for some reason” Had I not known the history myself, I’d absolutely get the idea from that thread that everyone who currently owns one has been issue-free and only the people who sold it or never owned it had an issue, which is far from the truth.

Personally, up until recently I never really questioned if NDSP would be able to see this thing through to the end. It was only when I read that corrupted captures are causing processor failures that I started questioning that. If there’s no way to know if a capture is corrupted and it can happen to anyone arbitrarily, there’s really no telling how many units could require a new processor. If I were NDSP, I’d be sh*tting my pants until it was known exactly what’s causing the corruption (curious if it’s the spotty Wifi during downloads) and a fix was enabled.

I’ll say this:

I contacted Sweetwater about the Wi-Fi stuff and they sent me a completely new unit. So I’ve effectively spend $1700 all in on a brand new unit from Sweetwater as I originally bought a demo.

 

[SeeD]

For sure, which is exactly why I took issue with the usual suspects sweeping things under the rug. That thread was an ideal place and time for some of those owners to discuss the issues they’ve had from a reliability standpoint, but they chose not to do so and did the “All good here, but some people really hate it for some reason” Had I not known the history myself, I’d absolutely get the idea from that thread that everyone who currently owns one has been issue-free and only the people who sold it or never owned it had an issue, which is far from the truth.

Personally, up until recently I never really questioned if NDSP would be able to see this thing through to the end. It was only when I read that corrupted captures are causing processor failures that I started questioning that. If there’s no way to know if a capture is corrupted and it can happen to anyone arbitrarily, there’s really no telling how many units could require a new processor. If I were NDSP, I’d be sh*tting my pants until it was known exactly what’s causing the corruption (curious if it’s the spotty Wifi during downloads) and a fix was enabled.

Just wanted to tell you this, that I have all the capture slots in my QC full , that is 128 x 8
I have only had one capture make my unit need a re-boot, and when this happens there is this box that tells us to send a crash report, so this will tell NDSP that this capture made something happen to my unit. Only once.
That capture was taken down from the Cortex Cloud, and I was told to delete this capture

So far so good, as with 2 of my other friends that have a QC ( they gig it live, with their feet )

 

[DrewJD82]

Just wanted to tell you this, that I have all the capture slots in my QC full , that is 128 x 8
I have only had one capture make my unit need a re-boot, and when this happens there is this box that tells us to send a crash report, so this will tell NDSP that this capture made something happen to my unit. Only once.
That capture was taken down from the Cortex Cloud, and I was told to delete this capture

So far so good, as with 2 of my other friends that have a QC ( they gig it live, with their feet )

I know, man, I know. You and @mbenigni are more than free to counter my posts with your experiences, but myself and others have already pointed out that you guys aren’t part of the problem bunch. I’ve seen plenty of posts about how the QC is working out great, people love the form factor and it works for them.

 

[Gearzilla]

 

[wharf rat]

I guess Im spoiled with the FAS GUIs. I really would miss them if they were less than they are, or completely non existent.

*edit* I hope I'm not the only one who now feels guilty for being a dad and owning more than one modeler

Maybe there will be a Fractal in my future.

Literally just sold my last tube amp! Guy just walked out of my garage with a mint AC10C1 for $300 American dollars.

 

[Stone]

Always say it what's best is what works for you and that you enjoy your trinket
for me The Helix works and its what's best for me

 

[Bruce]

Maybe there will be a Fractal in my future.

Literally just sold my last tube amp! Guy just walked out of my garage with a mint AC10C1 for $300 American dollars.

It’s a great ecosystem. Check out the forum if you aren’t already over there.

 

[Stone]

There may be a Fractal in the future for all of us

 

[Orvillain]

You spelled Iommi wrong
View attachment 3184

Bloody hell .... did he steal that from Mola Ram's private collection??

 

[andergtr]

the only forum i really liked was the now defunct hugeracksinc.com one. great people, relatively little flaming and relatively little bullshit. many of the guys on there could play, and it wasn't a whole bunch bedroom guys waxing about the minutia of shit that didn't matter when you turned up because...well...when you played at live volumes with drummers and other humans, that shit didn't matter.

this place seems cool.

 

[Orvillain]

the only forum i really liked was the now defunct hugeracksinc.com one. great people, relatively little flaming and relatively little bullshit. many of the guys on there could play, and it wasn't a whole bunch bedroom guys waxing about the minutia of s**t that didn't matter when you turned up because...well...when you played at live volumes with drummers and other humans, that s**t didn't matter.

this place seems cool.

Oi! I like whining about shit that doesn't matter!!

 

[the-trooper]

Oi! I like whining about s**t that doesn't matter!!

I like waxing it!

 

[Fireproof]