New Fat Jimmy reproduction Greenbacks

Boudoir Guitar said:
I've also got one of their's sitting on the same shelf, acquired in the same deal....
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I've wanted to buy a couple of Jupiters for quite some time, but they are very loud and effecient and I don't need stage volumes.

Of course now they've brought out those Midnight editions with slightly lower sensitivity and I've been drooling. I was only just now looking at their website again. And they have a break-in service! 🤤

I like the purple too.


JUPITER-SPEAKER-M10C-back_small.jpg
 
jellodog said:
It's half the sound of the amp. This is essential stuff if you desire access to all the toanz. Safest thing to do would be go bigger than you'd originally planned for this storage rack.
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My current speaker stash:

Weber 12" alnico blue dog
Weber 12" ceramic silver bell
Jupiter 12" LC-P
Eminence 12" Alessandro
Weber 10" ceramic blue pup
Fat Jimmy C1025

Will include a few more slots, but nothing too crazy -- I've moved on a few...ASW k-70s, Celestial greenbacks. Its more about trying stuff out to find "tones that I definitely want in actual guitar cab format, not just IR" than it is trying to have All The Tones
 
@EOengineer

Update - I tried the C1270 again. I fully like it now!

I'm running the Princeton Reverb a little hotter than I was last time (with an Ironman II) and that's probably helping to add a little more compression and give to the higher frequencies, along with pickups that are more even in terms of BMT - less glassy. Speaker is more broken in now too.

C1270 in a 1x12 extension cab sounds bigger and more muscular (suprise!). Bold.

C1025 has a touch more sparkle, especially in position 2 on a strat. There's just something about the C1025 that is well balanced and works perfectly with the Princeton to my ears. This is probably a personal taste thing.

It's hard for me to verbalise why, but I still prefer the 10-inch in the Princeton, but I could be happy with either. I'll probably play around with them more in future, but for now I have "my sound".

Having said that... I would love a Vibrolux 2x10 with the C1025s 🤤
 
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jellodog said:
@EOengineer

Update - I tried the C1270 again. I like it now!

I'm running the Princeton Reverb a little hotter than I was last time (with an Ironman II) and that's probably helping to add a little more give to the higher frequencies, along with pickups that are more even in terms of BMT - less glassy. Speaker is more broken in now too.

C1270 in a 1x12 extension cab sounds bigger and more muscular (suprise!). Bold.

C1025 has a touch more sparkle, especially in position 2 on a strat. There's just something about the C1025 that is well balanced and works perfectly with the Princeton to my ears. This is probably a personal taste thing.

It's hard to verbalise, but I still prefer the 10-inch in the Princeton, but I could be happy with either. I'll probably play around with them more in future, but for now I have "my sound".
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Interesting! Thanks for the follow up!

This post adds a lot of helpful context for me. Since I’m looking at the 1270 for a SFDR (my 1025 is in my SFPR) I can guess that the 1270 might be set up with the deluxe reverb in mind - which is a little bit more scooped and brighter than the Princeton generally.

Do you think the added volume this time maybe gave you more compression and that changed your perception of the speaker?

FWIW I’m one of those that prefers the Princeton with a 10 inch speaker as well. IMO there is some extra flub in the Princeton low end (perhaps to offset the smaller cab/speaker) compared to some of the other blackface circuits. A 12 gets too muddy for me and sometimes sounds like it’s being strangled by the cab.
 
EOengineer said:
Do you think the added volume this time maybe gave you more compression and that changed your perception of the speaker?
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A bit of that. I mean compression in the tubes and not the speaker, of course, because I was playing at moderate (not insane) home levels for a medium sized room.

I'm also pushing the amp in the front with a boost more these days to fatten things up. I've learned more about how to get what I want out of the PRRI and my guitar over the last couple of months. So there's a number of contributing factors.


EOengineer said:
I can guess that the 1270 might be set up with the deluxe reverb in mind
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I'm not sure. The reason I bought the C1270 in the first place was that The Fat Jimmy Jr comes stock with the C1270 and that's based on a Princeton Reverb. That's why I thought I'd prefer the 12 inch over the 10, even though I have a thing for 10s. I'm sure the 12 would be a better choice if I was gigging and needed more volume and headroom, but I'm not.

I wonder if the C1270 might be too much in your SFDR in terms of brightness, but I don't know. Lots of EQ options available to get it to where you want it, I suppose. Worth a try! Is the bright cap clipped on your Deluxe?
 
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EOengineer said:
IMO there is some extra flub in the Princeton low end
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Heh, agreed. That topic of flub is a bugbear of mine when related to speaker size and Princeton Reverbs, though.

People on forums mostly seem to blame that on 10 inch speakers and they think that switching to a 12 will magically fix that. That advice is handed out at TheOtherPlace™ all the time. Bah.

It's the mid-60s BF tonestack that is inherently flubby - it's not the speakers. Couple that with the undersized Princeton power transformer and it's made much worse!

But I still love it, warts and all. Anyway, 10s are totes awsum. Glad to be sharing the love here 🙂
 
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jellodog said:
A bit of that. I mean compression in the tubes and not the speaker, of course, because I was playing at moderate (not insane) home levels for a medium sized room.

I'm also pushing the amp in the front with a boost more these days to fatten things up. I've learned more about how to get what I want out of the PRRI and my guitar over the last couple of months. So there's a number of contributing factors.




I wonder if the C1270 might be too much in your SFDR in terms of brightness, but I don't know. Lots of EQ options available to get it to where you want it, I suppose. Worth a try! Is the bright cap clipped on your Deluxe?
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My deluxe is one of those goofy late 70s models that has the useless pull boost on the volume knob. I converted that over to a pull bright so I can bypass the bright cab. That ended up being essential for me since that amp almost always gets used with drive pedals. I think I’m going to have to give the 1270 a whirl.

I swear, pickups and speakers are always a gamble. You just never know until you try them with your stuff.

jellodog said:
Heh, agreed. The topic of flub is a bugbear of mine when related to speaker size and Princeton Reverbs.

People on forums mostly seem to blame that on 10 inch speaker and they think that switching to a 12 will magically fix that. That advice is handed out at TheOtherPlace™ all the time.

But it's the mid-60s BF tonestack that is inherantly flubby - it's not the speakers. Couple that with the undersized Princeton power transformer and it's made much worse!

Anyway, 10s are totes awsum. Glad to be sharing the love here 🙂
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Yeah I learned quickly that the blackface circuits require maintaining an inverse relationship between the volume and bass. As the volume goes up, the bass needs to go down or you are going to blow all your headroom woofing out on the lows…especially if you are using something like a LP or 335.
 
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Haha!

I'd be forced to sit on the Couch and watch stupid Rom-Coms over and over..... wondering the whole time
the movie is playing if it would ultimately lead to some sex later.

:facepalm

Give me mostly useless gear geekery instead! :rofl
 
la szum said:
70S Banjo GIF
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That’s my dude right there!!!!!

River People… “Creeker’s”.

My dude here knows the cuts-fires back with
those high register inversions..,
-like a little kid showing an old man how it’s done
proper….his name?
Ben Dover and you’ll find out real quick!!!
I can hear those f’n notes!!!!!!!!
 
Hey guys! Thanks to @jellodog for inviting me over to this forum and this thread! He reached out and asked if I could come over and extend to you guys the sale I'm currently running for gear page members. SO here you go... 15% off all Fat Jimmy speakers through the end of June. Use discount code GEARFORUM15 at checkout!
VintageFenderAmpRepair.com

Feel free to reach out with any questions at all.

You guys have likely read about or heard about Fat Jimmy speakers by now. I understand how incredibly difficult it is to shop for modern production speakers (and amplifiers) without hearing or playing them in person!! And on top of that you have everyone and their mother claiming theirs are the best...
A VITAL quality inherent in all Fat Jimmy speakers (and sadly lacking in the majority of modern production speakers) is the true sense of depth, space, and dimension. A real '3D' sound that almost seems to swirl out of the cabinet... it's the common thread I find in those 'magic' vintage speaker examples (when you're lucky enough to find a good one, a crap shoot in itself!)... vintage Jensen, JBL, Celestion, etc etc. They all have that very real sense of depth and space, even though specific tonal characteristics may be vary considerably. That's the main thing I'm going for in my line of Fat Jimmy speakers... that elusive '3D' quality. I like to play an amp with no reverb, and FORGET that there is no reverb!! I have received many emails over the years telling me exactly this lol...
This is one place where WGS blows all other manufacturers out of the water imho. They make top notch speakers and you'd be hard pressed to go wrong with any of their models, WGS house brand, Jupiter etc... all GREAT products. I worked with Dean over there (their designer) to come up with what I personally consider the cream of the crop. You'd be amazed at how much of an impact something like a different dust cap (with everything else being equal) has on the voice of a speaker!!

I will also tell you all that I will not put my name on ANYTHING I don't personally stand behind 1000%, or anything I would not/do not use myself. As a result, after almost a decade of building Fat Jimmy amplifiers, I have a reputation to uphold for providing the discerning musician with some of the absolute best amplifiers and speakers available today. Quality (build quality, parts quality, sound quality) is of utmost importance and it's hard to find another build that matches that quality - VERY few meet the same standards. ANY subpar product would be a strike against my reputation. I just... won't do that.

Again, please let me know if you have any questions at all! I'm happy to help when I can!
 
EOengineer said:
I love the c1025 in my 70s SFPR. Somehow it allows the amp to get the classic Fender clean, but handles dirt way better than the Utah speaker that was in there originally.

I’ve been considering the c1270 for my SFDR, would love to hear your take on that one.

The greenback clone looks awesome too, but probably won’t work for my situation. Excited to see how it sounds though.
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The C1270 is glorious in a real blackface or silverface Deluxe Reverb. It's tight and punchy in the lows, detailed in the mids, and smooth in the top. It's a very 'natural' speaker... meaning it gives you exactly what you put into it. I actually listen to music in my shop through a C1270 most of the time lol... I burn in a new amp (while building the next) by playing 'high production' classic rock... Floyd, Yes, Zeppelin, Beatles, etc. If it doesn't sound like a killer home stereo (giving me the full spectrum of tonality inherent in these recordings... from the deepest Moog to the most subtle hi-hat clip) I know something isn't right lol. Point is this speaker will give you what you give it. And it's great in a DR.
 
James Freeman said:
Why is everyone have to clone vintage Celestions?
I know exactly why, but FFS create something new that sounds great, don't parasite on well established names.
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I can't speak for everyone, but FFS I can speak for myself.

We HAVE put out MANY speakers that are 'new' and sound friggin' great.
Several FJ models are totally their own thing and can't be compared to any specific vintage speaker (except for that '3D' quality I mention above).
Why did we replicate a vintage Celestion? Easy. Because customers have been asking me for years and years for a British voiced speaker that delivers the clarity, touch sensitivity and detail my other FJ speakers deliver. And because, modern production, made in China Cs just don't sound nearly as good as their vintage counterparts. Kind of like how a real blackface Fender blows a re-issue out of the water when you put them side by side. Sure the re-issue sounds better than most of the other crap you can find in a Guitar Center, but compared to the real thing... it's not even close.
If C were to deliver their own modern production speaker that truly compared to their incredible vintage models, I would not have any chance (or need) to market a replica, as the 'original' would be out there and readily available. But... like most large companies, profit wins over product. Their new stuff just does NOT compare to their old stuff. So folks like us are left to fend for ourselves and try to fill the holes left by these incredible vintage pieces of equipment.
 
jellodog said:
A bit of that. I mean compression in the tubes and not the speaker, of course, because I was playing at moderate (not insane) home levels for a medium sized room.

I'm also pushing the amp in the front with a boost more these days to fatten things up. I've learned more about how to get what I want out of the PRRI and my guitar over the last couple of months. So there's a number of contributing factors.




I'm not sure. The reason I bought the C1270 in the first place was that The Fat Jimmy Jr comes stock with the C1270 and that's based on a Princeton Reverb. That's why I thought I'd prefer the 12 inch over the 10, even though I have a thing for 10s. I'm sure the 12 would be a better choice if I was gigging and needed more volume and headroom, but I'm not.

I wonder if the C1270 might be too much in your SFDR in terms of brightness, but I don't know. Lots of EQ options available to get it to where you want it, I suppose. Worth a try! Is the bright cap clipped on your Deluxe?
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You've got some great observations on the PR and speaker size! It's definitley not a 'one size fits all' scenario by any means.
First of all, PCB Fender RIs can be exceptionally bright. There are many reasons for this, but they can definitely take that blackface ice pick high end to all new levels lol. So with that in mind... the C1270 gives you what you give it. It's definitely not a bright speaker... for a comparison I'd say the modern Jensens are bright speakers. In a very unpleasant way that you can't seem to smooth out w/out getting muddy.
Blackface amps have a few 'issues' that I believe Leo would have addressed if he kept the company. His circuits were CONSTANTLY evolving and never stayed the same for more than a few years max. Blackface amps, even the best ones, can have too much low end and can have brittle highs (esp with a stock bright switch engaged) for example. There are reasons for this!
The Jimmy Jr would be in the same 'class' as a PR, but is not a clone by any means. There are a lot of differences, from the bias circuit to the tone stack to the operating voltages (which have more of an impact on the sound and feel of an amp than most people (builders included) realize). I agree with you 100% in that most 12"s just don't pair well with a PR. They seem anemic, like the PR just isn't pushing them into their 'sweet spot'. I made the Jimmy Jr. to suit MY needs... a low powered amp that kick ass in the home or studio, but also in low volume live situations where more presence and muscle is needed than you can get from a 10". Correction MOST 10's. (Remind me to tell you the Neal Casal PR/TXR story later lol)!!
The C1270 is kind of an anomaly in this regard... when I tried it in my Jimmy Jr... it just WORKED. I had tried the C1225 (25w) originally, but small magnet 12's just don't hold together in the low end when you push 'em. The C1270 just does. It just works incredibly well with the Jr, even when I play it on 1 or 2 volume in small venue duo gigs!! Most 12's won't work in this situation.
That said, I personally think the C1025 is a PERFECT match for a PR. It just WORKS in every way you can imagine. The cleans are big and bold and beautiful, the lows are punchy and the highs are sweet and round. And when you really push the amp... man that speaker sounds SWEET. It's like they were made for each other lol. That was not the intention, but it's the end result!!
 
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