Line 6 Helix Stadium Pre-Launch Discussion

[JiveTurkey]

Why not use a 57?

 

[Mooselake]

I didn't say workflows, interfaces, integrations, technical capabilities had reach perfection. I also didn't say the ease of dialing sounds had reach perfection. I said that when dialed in by people that know what they are doing, you won't be able to tell which is which. The point being that the modeling side has gotten to the point where it is not the biggest limiting factor to good products.

The quote you attributed to me in the post I quoted was not one that I made. I don't think anything is the pinnacle of anything. I was agreeing that clips on the internet are largely irrelevant to me, and why.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Why not use a 57?

why use a 57 when you can blend my favourite kick out mic with a ribbon, and then eq, and then hype knob, and then add some stereo delay and reverb for some reason.

With no shade intended to Igor who is a total dude and amazing at what he does. I just think the first demos on the site should probably come from a range of different people and show off more variety of cabs. Good demos are hard but not THAT hard

And if the brand new feature is the meat and potatoes amp modelling, then show us the tones with just meat and potatoes.

If you’re really proud of your new steak, you wouldn’t cover it in peppercorn sauce and popping candy before having a taste.

Better demos will come for sure, and I don’t think these will really put anyone off/blow anyone away. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to say that better demos are very possible and will happen.

 

[Fireproof]

I probably wouldn’t be able to tell simply because I’ve only had a couple of decent valve amps in my years of playing and neither of them are modelled in Helix / never saw any Kemper profiles for them! For that reason, I’m probably easier to please than some of you folks here who have had much wider exposure to some of the real ones on offer….. unless I get out then playing live again (I haven’t in a while) then it’ll be me playing through studio monitors and occasionally via a 1x12 with a Loudster providing the push. There will 100% be folks here who can pick out the real thing but I’m not one of them :)

Even though I’ve got no means (or experience) to a/b them, I still seek accuracy as a concept. But it’s a concept only - it’s what I think a Plexi sounds like and where am I getting that perception from? From records? I suppose that’s reasonable in a way as I’m playing back via the same studio monitors. If I’m honest, a fair bit of my perception of a plexi is from previous modellers. Sad but true and I doubt I’m alone.

Why do I want (need? :) ) a Stadium? Tone-wise I’m looking forwars to Agoura and also quite a few of the existing helix amps (I don’t have a helix). Improvements I’m expecting to hear vs what I have now will be from improved dynamics and ‘does it make me smile more than the old one’. That might make me sound like an absolute bedroom warrior (and I am these days unless I get out there again at some point) but what I’m describing here is probably true for a fair few people buying this (or any other) modelling unit. How many of us have photo-finish memories for the amps modelled in these things? It’s why it cracks me up when folks are upset at ‘only’ 16 Agoura amps and umpteen cabinets. I gigged with a single channel amp and a pedal board with several home-made dirt pedals for flavour. No-one left and everyone had a great time. Our love of accuracy is probanlg more to please ourselves and that’s entirely fair enough if we acknowledge that along with where we’re getting our ideas from!

A lot of my reasons for getting this are the other things it will do (focus view looks incredibly useful for someone like me who isn’t used to dialing in a real AC30 plus tons of other useful things) and the likelihood of cool stuff down the road via upgrades. Of course, buying futures is always risky but it’s got enough in there now to have caused me to buy and they’ve convinced me that it’s got sufficient hardware improvements over the previous generation to support upgrades for years - I could not convince myself of this with Kemper MK2 and they seemed uninterested in changing my mind on that!

Yeah for me I got into guitar late (in college). And it was more of a hobby so I was slowly learning over the years - didn’t play with a band or anything. For years I just had a peavy amp and my Uncle’s Fender Princeton and a handful of pedals, lol.

So for me - devices like the Stadium are so I can experience amps and effects I never got to in the analog world. So while I’d like them to be reasonably close to accurate in order to appreciate all the different flavors and nuances - I don’t have the ears or experience to really compare it to anything. So they don’t have to be 100% perfect for me to get a ton of enjoyment out of them.

And since I don’t have favorites knob settings burns into my brain - they hype and focus view features will be great for me.

And I do still jam with others so being able to play and learn at home and then take it to a studio or friends house is a lot more attractive than lugging my Badlander or something. lol. (Even though I love that Baddie!!)

 

[Fireproof]

Well, the QC's UI is very similar to the Helix's (a point not lost on Line 6) and mainly benefits from having a touchscreen. Obviously, the Stadium closes that gap, so here we go...

Closes that particular gap while also creating a lot of new ones for NDSP and others.

 

[GTR37]

Why not use a 57?

I can’t figure it out , I would venture to say pretty much 90% of Hard rock / metal tones that people are familiar would be a 57 or a 57/121 combo , it kind of the recipe for rock guitars

 

[paisleywookiee]

Dude, I seriously hate the website. What a dogshit experience on mobile.

 

[Orvillain]

why use a 57 when you can blend my favourite kick out mic with a ribbon, and then eq, and then hype knob, and then add some stereo delay and reverb for some reason.

With no shade intended to Igor who is a total dude and amazing at what he does. I just think the first demos on the site should probably come from a range of different people and show off more variety of cabs. Good demos are hard but not THAT hard

And if the brand new feature is the meat and potatoes amp modelling, then show us the tones with just meat and potatoes.

If you’re really proud of your new steak, you wouldn’t cover it in peppercorn sauce and popping candy before having a taste.

Better demos will come for sure, and I don’t think these will really put anyone off/blow anyone away. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to say that better demos are very possible and will happen.

If I was going to be charitable, I'd say they were trying to demonstrate how flexible the thing can be. But ultimately..... where is the bloody Killswitch 57+421 demo !?! Or better yet, a knock-off Deftones riff!!

I like a properly prep'd steak. But sometimes I just want to shove my face into the nastiest, beefiest, most evil choice cuts my local Irishman can provide.

 

[paisleywookiee]

Listening to the High Gain Agoura Tones:

- 1st one "Revv 120 Purple A". Kind of odd choice to have as the 1st one as these sort of tones (to me) are so associated with digital amps and purposefully sounding digital. I don't really like these sort of tones anyway so I don't have much of an opinion either way. Sounds fine
- Revv 120 A. Quite enjoying the low end bloom and the top end fizz sounds a lot less "Helix"y to me. Overall a bit dark/rolled off for my taste, but thats to do with the IR choice/mic placement.
- EV Panama Blue A. Another weird one. Are these baritone styles really that popular? How come 2 out of the first 3 tones are in this style. I really don't have a valid opinion one way or another. If I heard this without any context I wouldn't assume it's a demo for showing off amp modelling.
- EV Panama Red A. Reminds me of a red channel 5150 with that kind of scratchy attack that easily gets too much. Sounds fine, not really to my taste either though.
- Brit Plexi A. Nice dynamics, sounds less like previous gen Helix in the distortion and top end. Still dark sounding, which again is down to preference but I hope at least some other demos have a more open top end. Not really a fan of the stereo delay on there but whatever.
- Brit 2203MV A. Sounds good, besides the FX which I don't really like. Again it kind of shows the sounds I don't think current Helix's can quite do. And again, I'd like to hear more bite in the top end, but whoever's dialled it in has gone for a smoother ribbon sound.
- Solid 100. I don't like this. I think it's mostly down to the micing and amp settings. Lots of MV distortion or something weird from the pedal and amp blowing out. Kind of weird voicing from the cab. Lots of stuff I'd avoid but maybe for others, they'd dig this kind of tone.
- German Xtra Blue. Nice dynamics again. I don't like the cab/IR, but I think it's similar to the last one using the FET47 and ribbon. Sort of phasey and boxy sounding. Can hear potential in the low end weight of the amp but the tone here isn't something I'd go for.
- German Xtra Red. Sort of phasey and scooped in a weird way. Top end sounds kind of modeller-y to me here in a way that I wasn't hearing as much in the others. That reverb bothers me too, I don't think it's helping. The playing/tuning feels a bit disjointed too which Im struggling to look past.
- Brit 2203MV B. Not a tone I'd go for but it sounds pretty realistic in a good way.
- EV Panama Blue B. I can hear the potential here but I'd SOOOOOO MUCH rather hear a single sm57 than blending a FET47 and m160.
- EV Panama Red B. Very similar to the above, but just with the red channel. Kind of grind but overly blown out which doesn't flatter those palm mutes at the end. Not how I'd dial it in. Can hear the potential though.
- Revv 120 Red A. Sort of like a mix of what I'v said above. Boxy/phasey/overly blown out. I can hear the potential but I don't really like the mushiness, especially in the palm mutes. Why do so many clips have blends of mics/cabs and lots of additional processing? I think it's not helping things for the most part.
- Revv 120 Purple B. Again, sort of what I've said already above. Less poweramp mush in this one, so I like it better than most of the others. I'd way prefer this with a 57 and less processing on it.
- Brit Plexi B. Not really a fan of this but it sounds realistic enough. Probably the kind of tone that would do a solid job in a mix but in isolation isn't particularly nice. Phasey midrange and dull top again, which must be a preference for whoever dialled these in. Can imagine the phasiness is from the IR choices/blending. Surprisingly myself with how distracting the Helix reverbs are to me, again this tone would sound better dry with no reverb than having the reverb thats there applied.

I totally get why DI has reservations about posting clips, which sort of led me to believe they'd try and avoid the pitfalls of bad clips. These aren't terrible but if you don't typically like or use a U47 FET on guitars then you have to start mentally compensating for basically ALL of them. Great modelling sounds killer to me without any need for adding FX, additional EQ etc, and I don't think the FX are really doing anything thats justifying their presence on these clips. A handful of 57 on "dustcap meets the edge of cone" tones are a pretty solid reference point for high gain tones - even if its not someone's preferences its at least a familiar sound. I don't mind the FX so much on the cleaner tones, as often cleaner sounds are a bit of a canvas to stylise with FX.

Hopefully there's still time to get a range of audio demos from other people, so each persons own preferences get evened out.

Let me go through them, and see if we agree:

• Revv 120 Purple A: in case I run either my bass VI or a wet fart through the Stadium, I'll know how it sounds.
• Revv 120 Red A: a little better. Still sounds like an amp modeler modeling a tube amp that's modeling a POD HD era heavy amp.
• EV Panama Blue A: What in the actual fuck is going on here?
• EV Panama Red A: more gain than I'd use, but at least it sounds like a guitar.
• Brit Plexi A: Okay, now we're getting warmer. I bet it would sound better with better mic choices, like a 57 or 906.
• Brit 2203MV A: Yeah, this sounds pretty great, despite still using two (?) ribbons.
• SOLID 100: The bones are there, and I think this'll be a killer model, but WTF Line 6, a condenser and a ribbon?
• German Extra Blue: yeah I dig this, and I generally don't like this amp IRL. Same comment about WTF mics.
• German Extra Red: Kinda veering into "sounding like a modeler" territory, but it's not bad. A bit fizzy.
• Brit 2203MV B: JFC ew. Thinking this isn't remotely how I'd dial an amp in, nor the IR.
• EV Panama Blue B: skanky tone, in a good way. This sounds great.
• EV Panama Red B: Same here. Greasy, {InsertVagueSuperlativeHere}, cool tones, despite the shite IR selection.
• Revv 120 Red A: Dude. I just do not fucking like Revv amp models. Anywhere.
• Revv 120 Purple B: a little better, but eh.
• Brit Plexi B: this doesn't sound good at all. Sounds like someone replaced the IR with a Palmer PDI.

 

[EOengineer]

So things are going as expected with the audio samples…

 

[mikah912]

So things are going as expected with the audio samples…

I remember comments galore about Sean Halley repping the OG Helix with his official videos back in the day too. All of this will fade when a wider cast of characters get to show what it really can do.

I'm sure DI and the gang have plenty thick skin about this stuff by now. Igor anticipated the grumbling already when he admitted on Discord that he dialled everything in on the high-gain tones.

 

[AZG]

In my N=1 simpletons world, some devices sound good enough to me to inspire me to play a little more, reach a little further, while some others don't. There's analog and digital devices on both sides of that fence. OG Helix turned out to be a big winner in that realm. With the Stadium, it'll come down to whether once I turn it on, will I want to keep playing longer, with the baseline for comparison being my OG LT, which I have zero intent to part with. Clips over the internet are fun little appetizers to pass the time until shipping. But I already know there's a world of guys and gals out there who will make Stadium sound way better than I ever will, so I don't get too spun up good or bad on clips.

I agree. The more a device inspires me to play a little more, reach a little further, grin a little more, the more likely I am to keep it. Clips on the web are just something to wet the appetite, only playing it will tell me if it really satisfies. Thus far Fractal keeps wining that battle, and I have done the side by side personal testing with the OG Helix, QC, Headrush, etc.

But there are two primary reasons I will be giving the Stadium XL a go. The three buttons on the FM3 are a little too restrictive even with Fractal's excellent foot switch flexibility. And the second reason is the most commonly sited reason, the UI. I can get around the UI when needed, but it is clunky and unintuitive compared to others I've tested.

Line 6 is claiming the new modeling will be best in class. Being that the price of the XL is only a few hundred less than the Axe-Fx III, I consider them to be in the same class and hope to be impressed when comparing to the FM3. If I think the tones are equal or better, all the other goodies will be really sweet icing on the cake and it will be a keeper. If the tones fall a little short, return is likely giving the price.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

So things are going as expected with the audio samples…

I remember comments galore about Sean Halley repping the OG Helix with his official videos back in the day too. All of this will fade when a wider cast of characters get to show what it really can do.

I'm sure DI and the gang have plenty thick skin about this stuff by now. Igor anticipated the grumbling already when he admitted on Discord that he dialled everything in on the high-gain tones.

I totally understand their point about demos being hard and that it’ll never please everyone. But many other companies regularly do way better demos than these, it’s just par for the course in 2025. Really good demos are hard, but these are less flattering than they need to be IMO. I don’t think anyone would disagree with saying that there’s room to improve.

Different product, but I think Toontrack have really refined their products and how they market them and I think Line 6 would benefit a lot from a similar focus. Rather than “here’s a load of sick gear that we’ve captured really well” there’s a clear intention with what they capture and what users can expect from it. They misfired a few years ago with a few products that were pretty aimless, and it almost acted like a catalyst to get way more focussed on what they’re trying to do.

There is a clear intention and focus with whatever they make - they’ll track down specific drum kits, find the right person to tune and set them up, use a famous producer and engineer and they’ll base the setup and tuning of the kit around famous songs with a specific sound. And then the demos are very much going for those iconic sounds that people want.

I don’t think it would have been that hard for Line 6 to do a 5150 III demo that sounds like Testament or In Flames, or a Plexi that sounds like Angus Young, or a 5150 that sounds like Killswitch. These demos are kind of wishy washy, like they got in a room and decided what to make on the spot.

Given that Line 6 are aware of the shortfalls of audio demos, I’d have expected these ones to have been more focussed and better. And it’s nailed on that they’ll put it right on future demos, which just makes me question why these got the go ahead as the first ones.

 

[Whizzinby]

Note to future modeler manufacturers:

The Revv Gen should be the 57th amp you model, not the 7th.



The Bogner Ecstasy clips…

 

[jmcecil]

The quote you attributed to me in the post I quoted was not one that I made. I don't think anything is the pinnacle of anything. I was agreeing that clips on the internet are largely irrelevant to me, and why.

woops sorry about that .

 

[mikah912]

I totally understand their point about demos being hard and that it’ll never please everyone. But many other companies regularly do way better demos than these, it’s just par for the course in 2025. Really good demos are hard, but these are less flattering than they need to be IMO. I don’t think anyone would disagree with saying that there’s room to improve.

Different product, but I think Toontrack have really refined their products and how they market them and I think Line 6 would benefit a lot from a similar focus. Rather than “here’s a load of sick gear that we’ve captured really well” there’s a clear intention with what they capture and what users can expect from it. They misfired a few years ago with a few products that were pretty aimless, and it almost acted like a catalyst to get way more focussed on what they’re trying to do.

There is a clear intention and focus with whatever they make - they’ll track down specific drum kits, find the right person to tune and set them up, use a famous producer and engineer and they’ll base the setup and tuning of the kit around famous songs with a specific sound. And then the demos are very much going for those iconic sounds that people want.

I don’t think it would have been that hard for Line 6 to do a 5150 III demo that sounds like Testament or In Flames, or a Plexi that sounds like Angus Young, or a 5150 that sounds like Killswitch. These demos are kind of wishy washy, like they got in a room and decided what to make on the spot.

Given that Line 6 are aware of the shortfalls of audio demos, I’d have expected these ones to have been more focussed and better. And it’s nailed on that they’ll put it right on future demos, which just makes me question why these got the go ahead as the first ones.

I'm going to say that they could do more specific demos that speak to the iconic nature of the heads/cabs/etc. they're modeling.

People have already noted it, but we've heard the Plexi multiple times, but never in cranked "Kerrang!" Mode. Instead, a lot of single-coil and volume knob/playing dynamic variations. That's important TOO, but we wanna hear "the thing".

Same for the 5150 III first impression being a Satriani knockoff. That's not what people are using that amp for. It's a benchmark metal amp, so a metal player should carry that banner.

Rinse and repeat for a lot of the amps. I get that they really wanted to stress the dynamics, response and range of these amps. But for listeners who are not actually playing them and won't have a chance to yet, I think the demo should be mostly about sound.... specifically iconic, historic sounds. And yes, Line 6 needs a deeper, more modern bench of in-house players.

I will go to bat for the REVV amps and their inclusion, tho. They are basically line 6 partners at this point, and they are being used by a lot of guitarists who I respect (Most recently, in the rig rundown for Will Putney and Jordan Buckley of Better Lovers). They deserve their slot.

 

[banned]

The clean tones sound superb to me. Did Igor dial those in?

How come all of those have a 57 mic? How confusing.

I feel the character of many of the dirty sounds is there - but it's hiding behind some interesting mic choices.

 

[paisleywookiee]

Note to future modeler manufacturers:

The Revv Gen shouldn't be modeled. It's basically a Canadian Blackstar.



The Bogner Ecstasy clips…

FTFY

 

[banned]

Rinse and repeat for a lot of the amps. I get that they really wanted to stress the dynamics, response and range of these amps. But for listeners who are not actually playing them and won't have a chance to yet, I think the demo should be mostly about sound.... specifically iconic, historic sounds.

I AM listening for the dynamics and response mainly - as I'm a high dynamics/feel player.

I get a good sense of the 'feel' just listening to the clips via the initial attack/compression/response and I feel it's accurately modeled on the high-gain amps (although, I don't do metal so can't comment on that at all)

The Bogners, Brit2203 and Plexi all sound amazing to me. With the Plexi, I would have dialed for more krraaaang for sure. But it sounds good to me as is as well.

 

[SillyOctpuss]

I like the Revv Generator. I think it's a great sounding amp and wouldn't mind having one tbh.