Kemper Profiler MK 2

[Deadpan]

I can find more than two a weekend .

.... From the people who were stating that eDrums don't sound like the real thing .... and that the real thing sounds better even when the samples being used were real .

Still ..... yea, it was quite a reach .

When one hits an Edrum the stick position is predetermined? Where as an acoustic drum has a variable that potentially isn't acounted for in the sample?

I like E drums but there is a human variable that isn't preset in today's sampling.

Hearing Fear Factory live years ago was jaw dropping but real drums are a different animal.

 

[Orvillain]

When one hits an Edrum the stick position is predetermined? Where as an acoustic drum has a variable that potentially isn't acounted for in the sample?

I like E drums but there is a human variable that isn't preset in today's sampling.

Hearing Fear Factory live years ago was jaw dropping but real drums are a different animal.

You're right about that, but there is more to it as well.

There's a ton of modal interactions that happen when you strike a drum membrane (or cymbal for that matter!) and samples don't capture the physics behind that.

 

[laxu]

I know next to nothing about drums but the discussion is fascinating enough that I would love to see a few pages of posts moved to a separate thread under Digital and modeling.

 

[molul]

I know next to nothing about drums but the discussion is fascinating enough that I would love to see a few pages of posts moved to a separate thread under Digital and modeling.

True that. On it!

EDIT: we can continue here if you want: https://thegearforum.com/threads/e-drums-could-they-be-a-common-thing-for-small-bands-gigs.9298/

 

[Dimiguitar]

Soooo... Results of blind tests are?..

 

[paisleywookiee]

Soooo... Results of blind tests are?..

Still blind.

 

[Jarick]

Soooo... Results of blind tests are?..

Blind tests are so 2015

 

[Deadpan]

Soooo... Results of blind tests are?..

In both samples the Kemper is first.

I may throw the SLO100 at the Kemper next.

It will be good to have a few clips to compare the difference in the new profiling.

 

[Orvillain]

 

[Dimiguitar]

In both samples the Kemper is first.

I may throw the SLO100 at the Kemper next.

It will be good to have a few clips to compare the difference in the new profiling.

Quite surprising to me. Then I prefer the Kemper, in the first Clip, by a considerable margin. It sounds.. less like what I'm used to with my own profiles, and more like the source amps.

 

[Eagle]

As a Kemper and Axe 3 owner I can say that certain types of amp profiles definitely feel more real than the axe is capable of. Clean and break up amps are far more like actual amps to play through than the same on the axe. But the more gain you add to the equation the more the Axe comes in to its own. It’s also massively affected by how you amplify it because frfr is not an amp experience before you even get in to this.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Quite surprising to me. Then I prefer the Kemper, in the first Clip, by a considerable margin. It sounds.. less like what I'm used to with my own profiles, and more like the source amps.

I think both sounded decent (can't say much more, not the kinda sounds I'd use) and would possibly not be distinguishable in a sort of busy mix (maybe with the help of some EQ) anymore, but I also think it's beyond the point. Because, regardless of which version one prefers, outside of a mix, there's easily detectable differences. Which demonstrates that the Kemper isn't as accurate as other competitors.

Note, and as said umpteenth times before: Personally, I wouldn't mind. For my use cases, the "I'm fine" threshold has been passed quite a while ago already. But I'm not even close to being a corksniffer.

 

[Dimiguitar]

I think both sounded decent (can't say much more, not the kinda sounds I'd use) and would possibly not be distinguishable in a sort of busy mix (maybe with the help of some EQ) anymore, but I also think it's beyond the point. Because, regardless of which version one prefers, outside of a mix, there's easily detectable differences. Which demonstrates that the Kemper isn't as accurate as other competitors.

Note, and as said umpteenth times before: Personally, I wouldn't mind. For my use cases, the "I'm fine" threshold has been passed quite a while ago already. But I'm not even close to being a corksniffer.

Sure, if it's about accuracy, which sounds best is beyond the point indeed. It's just relevant if the issue is about sounding better or about whether Kemper has a recognizable tone.

For accuracy, imo the difference between Kemper and amp in clip 1 is large enough to where you may as well be listening to considerably different high gain amps through the same cab and mic.

 

[metropolis_4]

As a Kemper and Axe 3 owner I can say that certain types of amp profiles definitely feel more real than the axe is capable of. Clean and break up amps are far more like actual amps to play through than the same on the axe. But the more gain you add to the equation the more the Axe comes in to its own. It’s also massively affected by how you amplify it because "FRFR" is not an amp experience before you even get in to this.

My experience was similar. One of the best digital tones I’ve ever had live was using Profiles of a Benson in a Kemper Stage. I like the way Kemper sounds for those low watt cathode biased amp tones better than the axe

 

[Eagle]

My experience was similar. One of the best digital tones I’ve ever had live was using Profiles of a Benson in a Kemper Stage. I like the way Kemper sounds for those low watt cathode biased amp tones better than the axe

Agreed and the players experience is way closer to a tube amp than Axe3 . I think if you make great profiles of amps that are sympathetic to the Kemper’s core tone it hasn’t been equaled . Accuracy also depends upon this. Get a low gain tube amp set up in the studio and profile it then play the profile back through the same cab without moving it and you have the closest digital version out of what is available. This is by the measure of being sat in the room playing both ab.

 

[Dimiguitar]

As a Kemper and Axe 3 owner I can say that certain types of amp profiles definitely feel more real than the axe is capable of. Clean and break up amps are far more like actual amps to play through than the same on the axe. But the more gain you add to the equation the more the Axe comes in to its own. It’s also massively affected by how you amplify it because "FRFR" is not an amp experience before you even get in to this.

What do you think makes these profiles feel more real than fractal?

 

[Eagle]

What do you think makes these profiles feel more real than fractal?

The fractal is not as responsive to subtle nuances and feels slightly detached by comparison. A bit like putting a DAC in front of a really nice one channel tube amp.

 

[Chocol8]

Get a low gain tube amp set up in the studio and profile it then play the profile back through the same cab without moving it and you have the closest digital version out of what is available.

Have you actually tried this with Tonex, QC and NAM? I have, and they all beat Kemper easily. Enough so that I am baffled that anyone who has done the same testing could possibly conclude Kemper is the closest. It simply is not.

 

[hunter]

Have you actually tried this with Tonex, QC and NAM? I have, and they all beat Kemper easily. Enough so that I am baffled that anyone who has done the same testing could possibly conclude Kemper is the closest. It simply is not.

I have Tonex and Kemper and like them both. I find the Tonex can be bright and thin through PA where the Kemper doesn‘t have that issue. And of course way more I/O and FX. I like Tonex a lot more through an OX Stomp than with its inbuilt cabs. Ymmv.

 

[Chocol8]

I have Tonex and Kemper and like them both. I find the Tonex can be bright and thin through PA where the Kemper doesn‘t have that issue. And of course way more I/O and FX. I like Tonex a lot more through an OX Stomp than with its inbuilt cabs. Ymmv.

He specifically said played back through the same cab. In that case I think it is no contest. ALL of the newer options I have tried beat Kemper on that test.