Kemper Profiler MK 2

[MirrorProfiles]

What if any of that doesn't matter to me at all? If I was to purchase, say, a 2nd hand MkI (which might in fact happen in case their price drops yet some more), I'd possibly just get a bunch of MBritt profiles and be as happy as I can be. Case closed for me. I wouldn't even think about whether they are true to the captured amps (because I don't own them) and at least for the two times I had one borrowed, I didn't notice any sonic issues (be it aliasing or whatever) getting in the way of my enjoyment, either.
And I also didn't care whether it was "just" captures and no component based modeling because the profiles I loaded allowed for enough tweaking to make them suit my taste - and that was well before liquid profiling.

You could of course be telling me how I'm missing out on things, how I'd possibly have no taste in sound or whatever. But very likely none of that is true or would bother me.

Round we go again. This has gone in circles enough times, read all the previous posts again

 

[[Nathan]]

What if any of that doesn't matter to me at all? If I was to purchase, say, a 2nd hand MkI (which might in fact happen in case their price drops yet some more), I'd possibly just get a bunch of MBritt profiles and be as happy as I can be. Case closed for me. I wouldn't even think about whether they are true to the captured amps (because I don't own them) and at least for the two times I had one borrowed, I didn't notice any sonic issues (be it aliasing or whatever) getting in the way of my enjoyment, either.
And I also didn't care whether it was "just" captures and no component based modeling because the profiles I loaded allowed for enough tweaking to make them suit my taste - and that was well before liquid profiling.

You could of course be telling me how I'm missing out on things, how I'd possibly have no taste in sound or whatever. But very likely none of that is true or would bother me.

None of this has to do with aliasing or capturing accuracy, go have fun.
The kemper has plenty going for it as a workhorse gigging unit.

 

[LP59]

Profilers have one job and one job only: to accurately capture an amp.

That is their stated objective and the makers of profilers go to great lengths to ensure the capture mimics the profiled amp as closely as possible. Unlike modelers, that means you can objectively evaluate how well they attain their goal.

Does that mean you can't enjoy playing an inaccurate profiler? Of course not. Who knows, you may even prefer the inaccuracy. If so, that's a happy accident for you, but that enjoyment shouldn't blind you to the fact the profiler fell short of achieving its designed purpose.

 

[Jarick]

Are you past the return window at this point?

No, still in the window.

Honestly getting some great tones with my old favorite, Michael Britt Dirty Shirley captures from 2015. There's quirks for sure, but the other modelers I tried all have their own quirks as well. With a nice profile, you get a lovely warmth and midrange push that I can't find on the Fractal.

I'm kicking around if I want to try something like an Ox Stomp with the Fractal just to take IR's out of the equation. I've heard great things about it but few people use it. I could also run my Friedman through the Suhr RL into the Ox Stomp to mimic an Ox Box.

 

[KingsXJJ]

I'm kicking around if I want to try something like an Ox Stomp with the Fractal just to take IR's out of the equation. I've heard great things about it but few people use it. I could also run my Friedman through the Suhr RL into the Ox Stomp to mimic an Ox Box.

I’ve had my eye on the Ox Stomp as well. Interesting device for sure.

 

[Jarick]

The latest dozen pages are the examples of constant bickering bullshit I was talking about earlier. Yeah technically you're not attacking other posters but when it's a non-stop back and forth because some people don't care about aliasing measurements, what's that adding to the conversation?

Kemper measures poorly in some objective tests
Some people enjoy the sound of the Kemper

Not sure why people can't just accept those to be true.

Maybe there needs to be a better place to try to convince people to align their subjective opinions with objective testing.

My n = 1 is that Kemper can sound just as shitty with bad profiles as Tonex with bad captures, but the Tonex tends to be fizzier with bad captures and the Kemper sounds more garbled in the upper mids with bad profiles. I'll have to fire up the Tonex software again and hopefully they fixed whatever bugs it was having a couple months ago that prevented me from using it.

 

[KingsXJJ]

Using Camphor isn’t for everyone that’s for sure. Check with your Doctor first.

 

[KingsXJJ]

Pew! Pew! No forum rules broken!

 

[la szum]

The latest dozen pages are the examples of constant bickering bullshit I was talking about earlier. Yeah technically you're not attacking other posters but when it's a non-stop back and forth because some people don't care about aliasing measurements, what's that adding to the conversation?

I dig the Kemper, but there is some inherent squishiness/warmth (from compression??) that was just
present on EVERY capture I tried/used. Maybe it is the Kemper Secret Sauce. It can make it fun to
play for some stuff, and for other stuff it just drove me mad!

Nice to have options for different needs and moods, though.

 

[Jarick]

Yep, Tonex still an absolute steaming pile of trash. I try to load any capture and all I get is horrendous screeching feedback blowing out my ears.

 

[KingsXJJ]

If Fractal would embrace capturing we could capture a Kempar and all enjoy aliasing. Maybe Line 6 folks too!

Although that might interfere with some other additions they enjoy. Maybe the Stadium is powerful enough to run parallel processing so both could be incorporated simultaneously. Next gen win IMO.

 

[Jarick]

I dig the Kemper, but there is some inherent squishiness/warmth (from compression??) that was just
present on EVERY capture I tried/used. Maybe it is the Kemper Secret Sauce. It can make it fun to
play for some stuff, and for other stuff it just drove me mad!

Nice to have options for different needs and moods, though.

There is some warmth, but I don't hear more compression than the Fractal. I set up a similar amp model with similar gain and turn off any extra compression and they're both pretty similar. I think some of the mid focused tones of Kemper come from the prevalence of MBritt stuff which is pretty mid focused, but yeah there's a bit of mid focus on the non-MB captures as well. The Bert M stuff I was messing with definitely had more mid presence but still had a pleasant high end. There's not as much extension in the upper high end if you're after that kind of thing, so that's the warmth, but there was also more of a low end thump on some profiles that I couldn't recreate in the Fractal or Helix world. That wouldn't be super useful in a mix of course, but it's what you'd hear with a loud amp in a room.

 

[KingsXJJ]

Yep, Tonex still an absolute steaming pile of trash. I try to load any capture and all I get is horrendous screeching feedback blowing out my ears.

Another example of “You’re holding it wrong.” As good as it may feel and yes, the ToneX One’s small form factor makes it easier for beginners… profilers weren’t really designed to be put “up there” right beside your head.

 

[laxu]

I'm kicking around if I want to try something like an Ox Stomp with the Fractal just to take IR's out of the equation. I've heard great things about it but few people use it. I could also run my Friedman through the Suhr RL into the Ox Stomp to mimic an Ox Box.

There is absolutely zero evidence that OX Stomp is anything more than just UA's IRs and some room mic IRs. If it was, they'd have patents and would be touting that in marketing.

I don't believe there is anything that the OX Stomp can do that you can't do with Fractal already.

 

[Mikael Dez]

I don't believe there is anything that the OX Stomp can do that you can't do with Fractal already.

Or really any modeler that can run cab sims/IRs and some effects.

 

[Jarick]

I’ve had my eye on the Ox Stomp as well. Interesting device for sure.

Decided to order one as it's on sale. My old band mate from back in the 90's/00's (the before days) now does the P&W thing and uses the Ox Stomp along with a Dream. He's not a modeler guy at all but with the modern church thing you really need direct tone. I asked and he loves it, he could not get along with any IR's and this really simplified things for him.

 

[Jarick]

There is absolutely zero evidence that OX Stomp is anything more than just UA's IRs and some room mic IRs. If it was, they'd have patents and would be touting that in marketing.

I don't believe there is anything that the OX Stomp can do that you can't do with Fractal already.

The last thing I need is any evidence for guitar gear lol. I only care about two things: how does it sound, and how easy is it to use.

 

[Mongillo19]

The last thing I need is any evidence for guitar gear lol. I only care about two things: how does it sound, and how easy is it to use.

I do think it's important to use some evidence these days. Obviously ears trump all but with more and more snake oil claims from companies, it's not a bad idea to see if they are truly doing as they say.

Not saying OX is snake oil but just in general

 

[KingsXJJ]

There is absolutely zero evidence that OX Stomp is anything more than just UA's IRs and some room mic IRs. If it was, they'd have patents and would be touting that in marketing.

I don't believe there is anything that the OX Stomp can do that you can't do with Fractal already.

That may all be true and you are known for speaking truth and facts for sure Amigo.

The reason I find it interesting is the additions of the 1176 compressor, delays, reverbs, EQ’s (mic and master) all rolled up in to “Rigs”

That’s a pretty unique offering IMO. Kind of cool. Still needs a damn headphone output just like all the other UAFX amp pedals. GRRR. At least for me!

 

[KingsXJJ]

The last thing I need is any evidence for guitar gear lol. I only care about two things: how does it sound, and how easy is it to use.

And does it include freebies. Like aliasing and DC. Those things seem small but they add up just like latency. That’s why I wish extended latency could be offered as an option so we can just cut to the chase and be done with it.

If things like aliasing, DC and latency are resolved by some combination of new hardware or new firmware, I hope they add an option in the editor to re-enable them for people that prefer them. There seems to be a lot of folks that like things as they are. The last thing we should do is take that away from them. More thinking of others, I say.