Getting paid as a musician

[Bob Zaod]

I gotta say, since I moved out to NM I have had to fight tooth and nail for not only a minimum price for the band but to get paid at all. Back East in the Boston area I had no problems getting a minimum of 100 a head and after getting established, 200 a head. Took a little while to ferret out the places that didn't want to pay but we kept pretty busy eventually with the places that pay. Keep in mind this is "bar band, weekend warrior" stuff here.

The sad reality is that I had to acquiesce and make a choice. Will I play for the love of performing and make peanuts if we are lucky, or will I sit on the couch noodling away to the cats? I chose to keep playing. There are far too many bands and solo acts out here willing to play for absolutely no pay at all. I can see the venue owners and bar managers point when they say "why should I book you for 400 dollars when "X" band doesn't charge us at all and they play for tips?

If I ran a business ( which I have in the past) I would take the free bands (if they could draw) all day, every day over bands that are going to hit my take for a given night. This is under the assumption that said bands both draw about the same amount of people.

Does it suck? Absolutely. Will it change? Umm no. Sure I'd love it if we all rose up in unison and said no more freebies! Problem is the venue owners hold all the cards and they'd just buy a jukebox or pay a DJ 100 bucks to stream songs through his Harbinger tops.

One thing I have never been is a defeatist but I am 55 years old now, did ok with my money through the years and am comfortable. I am done fighting these venues and bookers over a measly couple hundred bucks. The good thing is playing for low base cash and tips in the right joints, I will never end up paying to play. I have also found some good players who have been here much longer than I, who came to the same realization many years ago and just want to play.

Yeah there's still that little Devil on my shoulder whispering " Tell them to GFY" when a venue offers me 100 dollars for the entire band plus 2 free beers each, but I digress...I just want to perform. It's like a drug for me. Not in a feeding my ego kind of way but in an entertaining people kind of way. I have always loved to entertain and see people happy and having a good time, even before I ever played an instrument or sang.

 

[JiveTurkey]

1. Pick different material. Classic metal is my absolute heart and soul but if you want to make money; you either need to do that stuff at an elite tribute band level (and even then; ehh?) or doing different material.

2. Venues that need the band to bring people in and don't already have a built in crowd are not worth booking. Your band is the jukebox. That's the whole point of the cover band exercise. You just have to load it up with different records.

 

[Alex Kenivel]

It's like a drug for me. Not in a feeding my ego kind of way but in an entertaining people kind of way. I have always loved to entertain and see people happy and having a good time, even before I ever played an instrument or sang.

I'm the same way. On one shoulder there's folks like my pops and my wife who wouldn't do anything for less than blah blah blah, but I was the most happy when living rent free at a punk venue playing for beer in a room packed full of people every other night. There's no better feeling than feeling everyone feeling feelings.

 

[sleewell]

merch is where we make the bulk of our money

fun is much more important to me than money though. I got a job to pay the bills. i dont enjoy playing covers so it would kinda be like a 2nd job doing something i dont enjoy and constantly worrying if it pays enough or not which is not how i want to spend my very limited amount of free time.

 

[fretworn]

I am so happy that my economic well-being is no longer tied to my ability to be a musician.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Playing for free is that 3 song, sit in on a jam night on the house gear set you do the first time you arrive somewhere in a brand new spot. At the very most.


OR


It's the weekly 17 song, 59 second grindcore set I will be parading out at the local waterhole for a cheap-a$$ bar owner

 

[JiveTurkey]

You CAN have a blast playing covers. Provided you have a fun group of people that are good at their jobs and get along. As well be good enough overall that you can command some decent $. This isn't necessarily as easy as it sounds in some areas I am betting. Mojo sent on that end certainly.

 

[Bob Zaod]

1. Pick different material. Classic metal is my absolute heart and soul but if you want to make money; you either need to do that stuff at an elite tribute band level (and even then; ehh?) or doing different material.

2. Venues that need the band to bring people in and don't already have a built in crowd are not worth booking. Your band is the jukebox. That's the whole point of the cover band exercise. You just have to load it up with different records.

Oh trust me know what "should" get you paid. Even the "premiere" bands out here make 400 tops for a 5 piece at a Casino. We are talking super tight as close to pro level as it gets, getting paid 400 bucks.

Thing is some joints out here that are run down shit holes @ 200 plus tips, you end up making more than you would at the Casinos. The wait staff pass the bucket around all night and if you entertained them you end up with 300 bucks in just tips. Those so called premier bands stay out of the shit holes though cos they think it's below them.

I am not doing the Metal thing yet. That is an iron in the fire at this point but all signs are pointing in a positive direction. Right now I am doing pretty standard classic rock stuff with some 90's alt stuff mixed in. I am still on gig hiatus after folding the tents on the last band, but have some stuff coming in October.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Oh trust me know what "should" get you paid. Even the "premiere" bands out here make 400 tops for a 5 piece at a Casino. We are talking super tight as close to pro level as it gets, getting paid 400 bucks.

Thing is some joints out here that are run down shit holes @ 200 plus tips, you end up making more than you would at the Casinos. The wait staff pass the bucket around all night and if you entertained them you end up with 300 bucks in just tips. Those so called premier bands stay out of the shit holes though cos they think it's below them.

I am not doing the Metal thing yet. That is an iron in the fire at this point but all signs are pointing in a positive direction. Right now I am doing pretty standard classic rock stuff with some 90's alt stuff mixed in. I am still on gig hiatus after folding the tents on the last band, but have some stuff coming in October.

$400 for a casino gig?!?!?!? Um no. I would be going the grindcore route if that was the pay ceiling Sounds like you need that relocation more than ever!

 

[Bob Zaod]

You CAN have a blast playing covers. Provided you have a fun group of people that are good at their jobs and get along. As well be good enough overall that you can command some decent $. This isn't necessarily as easy as it sounds in some areas I am betting. Mojo sent on that end certainly.

You are right....in most regions of the US that is. Out here it really is that bad. I have now gigged in 3 different regions of the US since 1988 or so and NM is the very worst I have ever run in to as far as pay goes. What I will say is it's far easier to draw out here than it was back east.

 

[Bob Zaod]

Sounds like you need that relocation more than

There's been a seriously tempting offer to stay here thats hard to pass up. We have had to re-consider. Still havent fully decided yet but let's just say it's a tough one to pass up.

 

[JiveTurkey]

You are right....in most regions of the US that is. Out here it really is that bad. I have now gigged in 3 different regions of the US since 1988 or so and NM is the very worst I have ever run in to as far as pay goes. What I will say is it's far easier to draw out here than it was back east.

That sucks. You would think the draw would mean more beverage sales and would mean some trickle down to the bands themselves. If they are drawing no matter who is playing, though; that obviously can cut your bargaining capabilities down significantly IF the venue isn't cognizant of the fact that having a steady rotation of GOOD bands will benefit the club and the local cover band scene in the long run versus booking whatever free turd is available on a given date and hoping for the best.

 

[KHAAAAAAANNNNNNN!!!!!!!!]

NM is the very worst I have ever run in to as far as pay goes. What I will say is it's far easier to draw out here than it was back east.

That sucks. You would think the draw would mean more beverage sales and would mean some trickle down to the bands themselves. If they are drawing no matter who is playing, though; that obviously cuts your bargaining capabilities down significantly. Ugh.

Yep JT. If anyone draws a crowd, the club owner will always take the cheapest option. I don't know if sharing the wealth "ever" existed at all. But if it did, it's long gone now.

 

[Bob Zaod]

That sucks. You would think the draw would mean more beverage sales and would mean some trickle down to the bands themselves. If they are drawing no matter who is playing, though; that obviously cuts your bargaining capabilities down significantly. Ugh.

Back east my wife and I ended up becoming very close friends with this couple that ran a bar/restaurant and our band ended up being the house band for a couple years before we moved. Just from being there so much and being so close to them I learned generally what it takes for a bar to make money on a given band night. I mean certain things do factor in like overhead and such but in general that typical bar had to draw about 50 people (rough avg of 3,500 take on the night) on a band night for it to make sense to pay a band 500 bucks. These are pretty general numbers but it gives an idea.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Yep JT. If anyone draws a crowd, the club owner will always take the cheapest option. I don't know if sharing the wealth "ever" existed at all. But if it did, it's long gone now.

Back east my wife and I ended up becoming very close friends with this couple that ran a bar/restaurant and our band ended up being the house band for a couple years before we moved. Just from being there so much and being so close to them I learned generally what it takes for a bar to make money on a given band night. I mean certain things do factor in like overhead and such but in general that typical bar had to draw about 50 people (rough avg of 3,500 take on the night) on a band night for it to make sense to pay a band 500 bucks. These are pretty general numbers but it gives an idea.

I edited my response above just a bit. Venues that book good bands on the regular should draw a good crowd. Which will in turn give a boost to that local cover band scene. Not as cool maybe as the original artist scene but still cool nonetheless. You will still have to negotiate in this environment but you will at least be negotiating with a venue that has some solid business and hopefully operating as a success vs. some sh!thole that is one bad night away from closing for good.

 

[DrewJD82]

Ft. Lauderdale experienced it’s fuck around and find out period with all of this already from 2012-2021, once covid restrictions lifted we had 4-5 new bars opening that were focused on live music because all the bars/clubs went to jukeboxes in the previous decade and I’m assuming they found out those don’t bring people in as much as bands do.

A couple of the bars seemed to have stayed in good faith with the local bands, there’s 2 in particular that actually promote the shows and from what I’ve heard are always fair with bands and payment but I don’t know actual figures.

Overall, I’m at the point now where I’ve realized that if I’m going to be in a band and be happy, the *only* goal and focus of the band should be “Play the local scene and have some fun”, because everything else thrown onto that wishlist is dependent on factors completely out of my control and/or will only lead to disappointment. Hell, just being in a band is enough of a crapshoot.

 

[Bob Zaod]

I hate to get all "Glory Days" here but I remember a time when every bar in my town and surrounding areas that had bands was packed to the rafters on Friday and Saturday. Also back then though you had to be good to get booked. I never had to deal with "how does your band draw"? back in the 90's. I'd say that started (at least in my home area at the time) around 2002 or so. It seemed to coincided with turning down so the bar staff can hear their orders. WTF did they ever do before that? Sign language?

 

[FuzzyAce]

The only way to make good money is be a Youtoob star and/or shill.

 

[HotRats]

I hate to get all "Glory Days" here but I remember a time when every bar in my town and surrounding areas that had bands was packed to the rafters on Friday and Saturday. Also back then though you had to be good to get booked. I never had to deal with "how does your band draw"? back in the 90's. I'd say that started (at least in my home area at the time) around 2002 or so. It seemed to coincided with turning down so the bar staff can hear their orders. WTF did they ever do before that? Sign language?

It was the same here in Italy, at least north Italy.

We used to play around 20 paid gigs per year with an original band in the far east side of this country, not in Milan or Rome.

I remember gigs in small villages up in the mountains packed with people. Something is basically unthinkable today. Unfortunately.

 

[la szum]

Haha! Musicians don't get paid. WTF?? Famous and popular musicians who wrote iconic songs don't get
paid----so what makes a weekend warrior think he or she should get paid??

Seriously, just retire already, Bob. It is great here.

Oh, and I made more gigging in the late 80's and early 90's relative to the cost of living (by a LARGE margin)
than I did in the 2000s or 2010s. It is even worse now.

The longer you stay in the game the worse it is going to get. No way one man, woman, or band is ever
going to beat back the tsunami of shit that is all the current trends in live music.

Truth hurts. Until we accept it is the truth.