Who actually uses the tone knob?

[Sascha Franck]

So if you accept modding is not 100% the same what’s missing and what is the effect of that on playing nuance?

Stop the BS, will you?

If you want to prove anything, ffs post some meaningful sound examples along with a video. You've got modelers, real amps and guitars, so what's keeping you away from doing so?
I'll tell you: It's BS you simply can't prove.
So, either put your money where your mouth is or stop trying to be Mr. Superior.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Fwiw, what I sometimes like doing is to dial the tone knob way back (almost fully closed), then use the bridge pickup and a wah to get into kinda synth-ish territory.
Here's some quick noodling:

 

[Dimiguitar]

Well, Fractal keeps updating their modelling and has often touted stuff like "better touch sensitivity". Or take cygnus firmware: it was supposed to uncover the "secret of chug ", implying previous modelling lacked such a quality.

It's probably only a matter of time till Cliff has a new revelation and the modelling is again improved. And it'll probably be marketed as an important advancement.

Considering this, I think it's at the very least possible that amp sims don't respond perfectly like the corresponding amps do to minor signal changes like volume pot turned slightly lower, depending on the testing standard.

Now is this likely? I can't say I've seen this effect in practice to a perceptible level or an extent that has me think such modelling is currently "less reactive", from the perspective of a player. But I also wouldn't be surprised if this was true, and another person perceives what I currently do not, or has done tests that illustrate it.

At any rate, I would like to see an illustration of these innacuracies provided they are substantial enough to hear. Make a test?

 

[FuzzyAce]

Fwiw, what I sometimes like doing is to dial the tone knob way back (almost fully closed), then use the bridge pickup and a wah to get into kinda synth-ish territory.
Here's some quick noodling:

Nice.
It's a good way to do it too. A clean tone mixed with a bridge pickup and wah can bite your head off a lot of times, so the tone knob is definitely your friend (unless you want to bite some heads offs). My main tones for a lot of years consisted of just a nice clean amp with a wah, vibe or phaser and the occasional drive. That's about it.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Considering this, I think it's at the very least possible that amp sims don't respond perfectly like the corresponding amps do to minor signal changes like volume pot turned slightly lower.

Of course that's likely - given that certain amp sims sound "different" (which we don't need to discuss about). But IMO that's rather related to the overall sound, feel and what not. On any sims nailing whatever sound (and there's quite some, countless blindtests prove that) or acting like great amps (without being accurate to the bone - and again, there's quite some of them), there's very little (or rather no) reason why the impact of volume and tone controls would be "diminished".

 

[Sascha Franck]

A clean tone mixed with a bridge pickup and wah can bite your head off a lot of times,

Defenitely. And as said, it's taking you quite into a different overall territory. In fact, just dialing the tone back that much already does - but it usually turns the sound into some dull, lifeless thing, so the wah adds that life back and adds some great controllable movement, kinda like what a synth player would do with the ModWheel.

 

[Iron1]

I'm in the "never use it" camp. Although, I'm a one-trick-pony sort. For me, it feels like dialing it off reduces clarity/adds mud and doesn't actually sculpt the frequency range. So, I use an MXR 10-Band for that sort of thing and leave the tone knob full-bore "treble."

Based on @Sascha Franck's post about 5 above this one, it's definitely a great tool in the right toolbox.

Just not mine.

On a tangent, since I spend a lot of time playing bass these days, my pet-peeve has become selector-switches that only give you 3 choices. I've recently learned to leave it in the middle and adjust pickup height to get the blend I want, instead of One-Both-The Other.

 

[FuzzyAce]

Defenitely. And as said, it's taking you quite into a different overall territory. In fact, just dialing the tone back that much already does - but it usually turns the sound into some dull, lifeless thing, so the wah adds that life back and adds some great controllable movement, kinda like what a synth player would do with the ModWheel.

Experimenting with tone caps is cool too. I have one set up using 0.01µF so backing off gets a pseudo cocked way sound. But ultimately I like 0.1µF with a 1M pot, because it puts a nice blanket over the brightness when needed. Very warm.

 

[2112]

Tone control on a Strat or Tele is a must for me - really fun with a fuzz or octavia too!

 

[HotRats]

Fwiw, what I sometimes like doing is to dial the tone knob way back (almost fully closed), then use the bridge pickup and a wah to get into kinda synth-ish territory.
Here's some quick noodling:

That's tasty, man.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

I rarely use it. Some if my guitars don't even have one.
But I wouldn't say I never use it. It depends on what I'm playing.

 

[Eagle]

Stop the BS, will you?

If you want to prove anything, ffs post some meaningful sound examples along with a video. You've got modelers, real amps and guitars, so what's keeping you away from doing so?
I'll tell you: It's BS you simply can't prove.
So, either put your money where your mouth is or stop trying to be Mr. Superior.

You don’t engage with the point ever . If you had tried this you wouldn’t make yourself look so stupid. It would take a day to put together meaningful clips and a video recording each with some kind of control. Try it yourself if you have that time to waste.

 

[Sascha Franck]

It would take a day to put together meaningful clips and a video recording each with some kind of control.

Nonsense. 10 minutes.

Try it yourself if you have that time to waste.

I don't have to prove anything.

 

[Chocol8]

If the input impedance of the next device inline, pedal or amp or digital amp sim, is the same, the pickups don't know the difference and neither do the volume or tone controls.

If you find the simulation doesn't behave like a real amp when adjusting the guitar controls STOP USING A KEMPER!!! That's one of the biggest flaws of a Kemper, and one that even a lowly $150 Tonex does not suffer from in the modern age.

 

[metropolis_4]

Not to get preachy, but…

A lesson I’ve learned about guitar forums: It’s never worth questioning what someone else claims they hear.

We all perceive sensory stimulation differently, these are personal subjective experiences, and it’s not like lives hang in the balance

You say you can hear a difference in tone from one extra wind on the pickup bobbin? I don’t hear that at all… and we’re both right

 

[Chocol8]

Nah, there are some places where the laws of physics outweigh whatever it is people claim they hear.

 

[Eagle]

If the input impedance of the next device inline, pedal or amp or digital amp sim, is the same, the pickups don't know the difference and neither do the volume or tone controls.

If you find the simulation doesn't behave like a real amp when adjusting the guitar controls STOP USING A KEMPER!!! That's one of the biggest flaws of a Kemper, and one that even a lowly $150 Tonex does not suffer from in the modern age.

Axe3

 

[DrewJD82]

At most they act as a hold-over until I can make it to the amp to tweak the Treble/Presence for me, outside of that they’re all the way up 100% of the time.

When I first discovered ‘tone’ and that we actually had a control over it in the general sense, my only guitar was my standard MIM Strat in the mid-90’s when all I listened to was Gilmour and EJ, who have such nice ‘warm’ tones rather than the shrill sound of a shitty single coil into a not-so-awesome amp. Rolling down the tone knob was the only way I could obtain something that seemed similar at the time, but once I finally heard what was actually happening and how that all sounds outside of playing by myself I stopped entirely and those knobs have been on 10 ever since!

 

[DrewJD82]

What means "often?" I've seen a number of active basses in use, but substantially fewer active guitars. Are you saying that guitars with active electronics don't ever have tone controls that allow bass-cut shelving? I have neither knowledge of nor interest in that market segment, but I'm pretty sure it's a niche. BTW, what exactly is a "modern metal guitar?"

 

[Chocol8]

Bonus points for the box label