Tone X Capture Thread

EOengineer said:
The Axe IO One isn’t here yet. I used my Helix floor to get instrument level to the amp and I had a Captor between the amp and cab so there’s a real impedance curve there.

I’d like to try another where I push the amp master a bit more.
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Oh shit, I didn’t even think of that. Are modelers the perfect capture box, maybe? If you used the modeler for the cabinet/mic and then as the USB interface?
 
paisleywookiee said:
Oh shit, I didn’t even think of that. Are modelers the perfect capture box, maybe? If you used the modeler for the cabinet/mic and then as the USB interface?
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This is exactly how I made all my Captures. It’s a complicated signal chain. I have a Suhr RL, the KA interface and an AXE III. I can draw it out if you have a similar setup. Even something like a Helix would work for the IR.
 
texhex said:
This is exactly how I made all my Captures. It’s a complicated signal chain. I have a Suhr RL, the KA interface and an AXE III. I can draw it out if you have a similar setup. Even something like a Helix would work for the IR.
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I do in fact have a similar setup if you have the time 😬 I have the Axe Fx, Suhr, and a audient interface
 
paisleywookiee said:
Oh shit, I didn’t even think of that. Are modelers the perfect capture box, maybe? If you used the modeler for the cabinet/mic and then as the USB interface?
Click to expand...
Someone more intelligent probably knows a way to do it all with the helix, but I had to create an aggregate device with the Helix and my Focusrite 2i2.

I’m running my guitar into the Helix guitar input, that comes out of Helix USB1/2 on path A.

Helix path B receives the output of the guitar signal from the DAW and sends it out of path B using send 1 on the helix to the amp input.

I’m then using the Captor between the head and cab into my focusrite channel 1 which feeds the amp back into the DAW to complete the chain.

I’m not 100% on how the helix is managing the levels yet - there may or may not be some gain staging stuff still happening. Lots of learning happening right now. :rofl
 
texhex said:
This is exactly how I made all my Captures. It’s a complicated signal chain. I have a Suhr RL, the KA interface and an AXE III. I can draw it out if you have a similar setup. Even something like a Helix would work for the IR.
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That’d be awesome!
EOengineer said:
Someone more intelligent probably knows a way to do it all with the helix, but I had to create an aggregate device with the Helix and my Focusrite 2i2.

I’m running my guitar into the Helix guitar input, that comes out of Helix USB1/2 on path A.

Helix path B receives the output of the guitar signal from the DAW and sends it out of path B using send 1 on the helix to the amp input.

I’m then using the Captor between the head and cab into my focusrite channel 1 which feeds the amp back into the DAW to complete the chain.

I’m not 100% on how the helix is managing the levels yet - there may or may not be some gain staging stuff still happening. Lots of learning happening right now. :rofl
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Yeah, I’m thinking there has to be a way to do this without anything but the amp, reactive load, and modeler; in my case, the FM9. The FM9 has the guitar input (1), line input (2), and then send (3, which is unity gain for 4CM), and then two sets of outs. It should just take some routing work in the grid for it to work right.
 
I said it was a little complicated but it really works and I've had great success with Tonex using this setup.


Z61GbIp.png




The colors in the Tonex screen above match the input and output colors in the drawing below.
The yellow lines are their own connections (not in Tonex) between the Amp, Shur RL and AXE.


8pPtHu9.jpg



The signal chain in the Axe lets me put an Axe drive into the front of my amp from the Axe so I can use all the drives in the Axe to drive the Amp.
  • OUT3 from Axe goes to front of amp
  • IN3 on Axe is fed from Shur RL
  • The IR player or Fractal Cab (yeah... it's really cool with Dyna-Cab) is where you load your IR and then you send everything out OUT4 back into your interface and into Tonex.
noYpSNh.png



You adjust the levels on your interface and Axe so that nothing clips when you are walking through the Tonex setup. Getting all the levels not to clip is key.

Output 1L (BLUE line) goes to input 1 on the Axe because it lets me control the output signal from the interface to the Axe using the interface volume knob.

In the Tonex setup I'm monitoring (RED line) on outputs 3,4 on my interface because my interface has a separate 1,2 and 3,4 monitor out. All sound is coming out of my interface through that stereo headphone out on outputs 3.4. This way I can monitor the entire process from the interface.

This setup works like a champ, every single Tonex Capture I've made with this is dead bang on compared to the amp. Having the ability to load any IR or Dyna-Cab is kick ass and totally changes the sound of the Captures. You can also eliminate the IR completely and capture direct.
 
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texhex said:
I said it was a little complicate but it really works and I've had great success with Tonex using this setup.


Z61GbIp.png




The colors in the Tonex screen above match the input and output colors in the drawing below.
The yellow lines are their own connections (not in Tonex) between the Amp, Shur RL and AXE.


8pPtHu9.jpg



The signal chain in the Axe lets me put an Axe drive into the front of my amp from the Axe so I can use all the drives in the Axe to drive the Amp.
  • OUT3 from Axe goes to front of amp
  • IN3 on Axe is fed from Shur RL
  • The IR player or Fractal Cab (yeah... it's really cool with Dyna-Cab) is where you load your IR and then you send everything out OUT4 back into your interface and into Tonex.
noYpSNh.png



You adjust the levels on your interface and Axe so that nothing clips when you are walking through the Tonex setup. Getting all the levels not to clip is key.

Output 1L (BLUE line) goes to input 1 on the Axe because it lets me control the output signal from the interface to the Axe using the interface volume knob.

In the Tonex setup I'm monitoring (RED line) on outputs 3,4 on my interface because my interface has a separate 1,2 and 3,4 monitor out. All sound is coming out of my interface through that stereo headphone out on outputs 3.4. This way I can monitor the entire process from the interface.

This setup works like a champ, every single Tonex Capture I've made with this is dead bang on compared to the amp. Having the ability to load any IR or Dyna-Cab is kick ass and totally changes the sound of the Captures. You can also eliminate the IR completely and capture direct.
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This is super awesome and wonderful for you to have written up. Can't wait to try it!
 
MirrorProfiles said:
View attachment 9144

Curious if someone can measure the reamp output of the Axe I/O one with a multimeter, as IMO -3.5dBu is very low and would need a very loud input signal to reach unity gain.
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Mine will get here some time this week and I will take a look. Based on some things I've seen from @yeky83 I do believe the "to amp" reamp output might be a little low compared to the output we see from some pickups. If their hardware isn't up to the task I'll find some other reamp box.
 
EOengineer said:
Mine will get here some time this week and I will take a look. Based on some things I've seen from @yeky83 I do believe the "to amp" reamp output might be a little low compared to the output we see from some pickups. If their hardware isn't up to the task I'll find some other reamp box.
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Thanks! Will be awesome to know whether that value is correct - in theory it should be an ideal device for making models.

Either way, a lot of people will buy this for specifically making models for ToneX so a lot of models will be made for whatever signal this is putting out. Will be very useful to know.
 
I was just alerted by the Mods and Admins of the Forum that you will be charged $39.99 to be able to
continue to post in this thread. :stirthepot


:LOL:
 
EOengineer said:
So I set up a small experiment and created my first capture - my Ceriatone 2204 using a middle of the road crunch tone through my 1x12 oversized cab with an EVM12L, direct captured through my Captor so you get authentic cabinet impedance interaction. Use your preferred IR - I recommend something with Greenbacks or 75watt celestions but you do you.

Don't eat me alive, I don't know what I'm doing yet. :bag

I do plan on eventually following up with captures at the same settings but with my 1960 connected, and one using just the Captor - I think it might be a fun experiment to see what impact those impedance curve changes have on the captures.

www.tone.net

Ceriatone 2204 Crunch Direct V1

Direct Capture of a crunchy late 70s spec 2204 w/bright cap
www.tone.net www.tone.net
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Thanks for uploading these! I played around with the first three yesterday and really enjoyed them. I'm going to check out v4 and v5 this evening.
 
marshall2553 said:
Thanks for uploading these! I played around with the first three yesterday and really enjoyed them. I'm going to check out v4 and v5 this evening.
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Thank you for the feedback. FYI v4&5 are identical to v2&3 but use the reactive load from my Captor instead of the 1x12 EVM12L cab that was used for v1-3. I haven’t compared them but my guess is it’s a minor difference.

Later this week I’m going to follow up with bright cap and no bright cap captures using the same settings while using my 1960a 4x12 cab as the load.

It’s a bit of mad science, and hopefully I’m not sending people on a goose chase trying all these captures, but I’m curious to find out what difference the load actually presents when creating captures.

Once I get through this madness I’ll dial in some captures. I’ve actually enjoyed the process so far.
 
EOengineer said:
Thank you for the feedback. FYI v4&5 are identical to v2&3 but use the reactive load from my Captor instead of the 1x12 EVM12L cab that was used for v1-3. I haven’t compared them but my guess is it’s a minor difference.

Later this week I’m going to follow up with bright cap and no bright cap captures using the same settings while using my 1960a 4x12 cab as the load.

It’s a bit of mad science, and hopefully I’m not sending people on a goose chase trying all these captures, but I’m curious to find out what difference the load actually presents when creating captures.

Once I get through this madness I’ll dial in some captures. I’ve actually enjoyed the process so far.
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Ah, I'll check those out again and see if I can hear the difference between the load and actual cab. How was the bright cap set on the ones you've uploaded so far? I assume it was on, but I didn't know if you could select different values for it on that Ceriatone 2204.
 
marshall2553 said:
Ah, I'll check those out again and see if I can hear the difference between the load and actual cab. How was the bright cap set on the ones you've uploaded so far? I assume it was on, but I didn't know if you could select different values for it on that Ceriatone 2204.
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The description for each capture will mention if the bright cap is bypassed. Any of the bright cap enabled captures I’ve done so far are using the stock 1000pf bright cap.

The Ceriatone 3 way bright cap toggle for the 2204 uses 1000pf, 100pf, and bypass. I find I typically use either the 1000pf or bypass settings. I almost always bypass the bright cap with my single coil fenders, almost always use the 1000pf with my Gibson style guitars.
 
If I’m not mistaken, yeky’s issue wasn’t that his unit had issues or was misbehaving, it’s that the design specification meant that the maximum signal level is significantly lower than what a guitar pickup would produce.

IMO if the published specs say -3.5dBu or -6dBu for the maximum signal level, then the test signal by definition is a far lower voltage than a guitar would typically output.

That’s not a bug, it’s a topic of discussion for users and potential users to base their decisions on whether they want to purchase the unit with (or if they have purchased one, how they can get the best use out of it). Anecdotal experiences of “well it works fine for me” aren’t anywhere near as helpful as the published specification of what the unit is capable of.

IMG_3480.jpeg
IMG_3481.jpeg


It’s already established that Tone Partners are selling models with a wide variety of internal operating levels. Some are providing this information but most aren’t. Without knowing that information, it makes it very hard for the user to hear the tones as desired - the range of possible input levels can be anywhere from +/- 20dB
 
MirrorProfiles said:
If I’m not mistaken, yeky’s issue wasn’t that his unit had issues or was misbehaving, it’s that the design specification meant that the maximum signal level is significantly lower than what a guitar pickup would produce.

IMO if the published specs say -3.5dBu or -6dBu for the maximum signal level, then the test signal by definition is a far lower voltage than a guitar would typically output.

That’s not a bug, it’s a topic of discussion for users and potential users to base their decisions on whether they want to purchase the unit with (or if they have purchased one, how they can get the best use out of it). Anecdotal experiences of “well it works fine for me” aren’t anywhere near as helpful as the published specification of what the unit is capable of.

View attachment 9183View attachment 9184
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