JiveTurkey
Goatlord
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- 20,898
The idea of it on the surface is great. But I'd rather just buy the real amps I want or lean into the great things about the Axe. I would be willing to give a JVM module a go if they keep working with Marshall.
Synergy Owners Thread
- Thread starter Mongillo19
- Start date
I'm largely a committed Fractal user, but I wanted to explore the Synergy stuff as it's picked up more steam. I will say that I thought it sounded pretty bad through the Power Station, and I returned the PS shortly after this. The Classic 50/50 just came in and is quite good but I need to do a direct A/B with running the Synergy into the return of my 5153 EL34 50W, which has been by far my favorite way to run the Synergy modules. Currently have Savage, HBE, and Powerball on hand.
In fact I started with the Syn-20IR and traded that off as I didn't think it was very good -
Whether I prefer any of these configurations to the Fractal remains an open question. I think it's probably going to be more fun to explore modules that don't have Fractal equivalent models.
In fact I started with the Syn-20IR and traded that off as I didn't think it was very good -
- I didn’t like having depth, presence, and sag mashed into the same reactance knob. I want to adjust those things separately.
- Structure is quite subtle.
- Running the preamp into my EVH 50w EL34 sounded so much better. That power amp made the Synergy modules sound immense in comparison to the 20.
- Running the preamp into a Power Station, on the other hand, was not very satisfying. That thing is practically a hi-fi amp. Is the Syn 50/50 also this stiff? Syn-20 is much preferable to PS.
- I don’t like the sound and feel of the amp running direct through an IR. It might have been better with IRs shot through tube amps, which I can’t find the files for anymore. But with the onboard IRs or the ones I usually use, didn’t love it.
Whether I prefer any of these configurations to the Fractal remains an open question. I think it's probably going to be more fun to explore modules that don't have Fractal equivalent models.
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- 170
I don’t get that much noise with pure 4CM in my rig. I had noise issues when I tried running analog drives before the amp, but I get decent flexibility out of the Fractal drives before the amp, so don’t feel like I need to get into analog drives. Some people may notice latency, but it’s never been an issue for me.
This is a busy weekend with a big music festival this afternoon and my band is playing the day after party tomorrow at one of the main venues that support our local music scene tomorrow, but I’ll try to post more details in a couple of days.
For now I’ll just say that the Killer Kali is much easier to get sitting into the mix and covers more ground than my JP2C. I also went with a BMan for my clean and lower gain tones in the live rig. I also have the TW/DLX which I really like, but the BMan has more gain and I can roll off my volume controls to get close to what the DLX channel does. Also just picked up the Uber and that will work layered into recordings, but not what I need for live sounds. Kali is much more versatile.
My old rig I had the VH4, first version of SLO, MkIIC+, HBE, the Vai, and the TW/DLX. Note that the only one I felt I wanted again was the TW/DLX. Will elaborate on those others when I have time.
I run my Synergy stuff through the power station using self attenuation so it is loaded down to line level into my FM3 - sounds great
Desertdweller
Shredder
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- 1,503
Yep, I've done some similar things too. The Axe FX amp models sound infallable direct recorded, but I've always fought frequencies when trying to set up a preset to run them to a real power amp. Whether it's a SS Seymour Duncan or a tube Mesa or Synergy power amp, I'm not quite there with the Axe FX models. Insane direct though for sure.
This new JMP module is interesting. As @paisleywookiee said we have no real need for more Marshall tones out there, but there's some nostalgia in me for a simpler time when the Triaxis, JMP1, and Rocktron Piranha were what my friends and I played with and what I saw from bands that had rack gear at the time, so any recreation of that era in modern tech is probably going to be a purchase from me.
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- 11,880
I should remind myself regularly that buying a load box to record my amps with did not give me one single bit of "better" in comparison to what I was already getting from the AxeFX, if anything it was more limiting going back to actual amps. I'm going to assume that if playing the actual amps didn't do anything new for me, preamp-only versions of the amps are most likely not going to move the needle either.
They're still cool AF though and I think it'd be fun to build a Vai-like rack with the Synergy and a Fractal.
They're still cool AF though and I think it'd be fun to build a Vai-like rack with the Synergy and a Fractal.
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- 170
I would probably be the same, but I have the luxury of having a relatively soundproof room that is far enough from neighbors that I can crank up through 2 4x12s with 2 mics on each cab and change my tone when mixing by just balancing the mics in different proportions. My closest neighbors are always trying to get me to open up the door so that they can hear it more, but they are regulars at our favorite venue in town and hired us to do their wedding last year. I have a hunch the other neighbors would be calling the cops if I did.
Not everyone has a place to mic up a loud amp, and back when I was in that position I did a lot of recording with every generation of the Axe-FX and was quite satisfied with the results.
mbugbee
Groupie
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- 56
I’m really curious how much difference there would be in synergy vs fm3 into a 5153 50w power amp.
- Messages
- 11,880
At the rate I've been buying shit for the last couple weeks, all it will take is a good deal to pop up!
The difference is that one is an actual preamp and one is an emulation which is subject to updates which you were told the last one was the most realistic it ever sounded.
Richard_G
Roadie
- Messages
- 397
Probably as much difference as one would expect there to be between two different 5153 amps.
Ed DeGenaro
Shredder
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- 1,827
What I’ve found over the years is that as soon as it goes in a speaker sim the fun factor of playing goes down.
Furthermore, even a choked down speaker running with any set-up recovers most of it.
So much so that I prefer miking a low volume speaker and mixing it in with Ox or IRs.
Side note, I have to find a Soldano sim that without boosting has the amount of gain of the X88 on tap.
Side note 2, about 15 some years when I integrated the AxeFx with my modded JMPs I found that a digi box with the same gain as the amp needed gating. The amp I could wrestle without.
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- 170
I was thinking the load box into IR doesn’t quite give me the same as what I can get cranking up into a cab and mics. That seems to be the weakest link.
I probably don’t need to be as loud as I record for most things, but I love getting real feedback on a few things, so I push it pretty loud when doing those parts.
My latest head to head, the return of the 5150 III EL34 50W versus the Peavey Classic Series 50/50 power amp. (The Crown is a seat filler.) If you don't know, the Peavey 50/50 here is an 8x EL84 2U power amp, bridgeable. For this comparison I used the Savage module, and volume matched the 5153 to a single channel of the Classic for comparison into the 16 ohm Orange PPC 212 V (Neo Creambacks). Fiddled with the presence and resonance of both to get in the same ballpark. This cab sounds incredible, by the way, and at 44 lbs is remarkably portable for an Orange.
This was a long and hard head to head, with the amps trading blows round after round. The Peavey was able to match the EVH for punch, touch response, and "organic feel". But in the end, the 5150 stood as champ, bringing an incredible mid-range clarity and "3D ness" that made the Peavey sound congested and even muddy in the mid-range. It's not something you would notice without the A/B comparison, but with the two in close proximity, the Peavey just wasn't quite there. Still an amazing budget tube amp in its own right, bringing double the power and/or stereo to the party for frequently under $500. It doesn't have the wimpiness associated with EL84s. But for me, the 5150 III reigns supreme.
At this stage I should note that there's no right or wrong answers for what the "correct" sound is of a Synergy power amp, yeah? The EVH is just my favorite amp of all amps period. And so there's a good possibility that what the 5150 actually does best is to make everything coming in sound like a 5150, which is just an automatic winner for me because that's my sound. I would really like to get my hands on a Syn-50 next as being the most likely "intended sound" of the Synergy system.
JiveTurkey
Goatlord
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- 20,898
EL84s always lose. Duh! Unless it's a Vox.