Plexi vs DSL comparison

[MirrorProfiles]

I won an Origin 20, absolutely not my kind of amp stock. I don't personally feel like its a good representation of a Marshall and I don't even think its particularly well designed. The amp only sounds good to me with the master cranked, at which point its REALLY loud. The power scaling helps a bit but its still extremely loud and ends up defeating the purpose.

I feel like they should have used a solid state FX loop and used the extra valve to make the circuit a more traditional Marshall JTM/1959 style preamp. I think I'd have preferred fixed bias 6V6's than cathode biased EL34's, forcing EL34's into these amps (at least the ones below the 50) feels like marketing more than anything.

Its a well priced amp, but you're still looking at £300 or so over here which can usually find you a DSL or Vintage Modern. I'd even take a JCM900 or valvestate over it, personally. My favourite thing about the Origin series is Jason Tong and Shea have proven them to be great modding platforms. I believe Dave Friedman and Dan Gower have also done mods for them. I think its a simple enough circuit that you can repurpose it into basically anything without any fear of missing the old tones.

 

[EOengineer]

I won an Origin 20

Ok I’m gonna need details.

Right now I’m imagining you walking into a GC and challenging a sales guy to a foot race for an Origin. Here for it too.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Ok I’m gonna need details.

ha nothing as exciting as that. a few years ago there was some mixing competetion on a facebook group that Marshall sponsored. I usually avoid those things but it was around Christmas/New Years and I thought I'd just spend half a day on it for a laugh.

Figured it would make a cool modding platform, still haven't got around to doing anything with it, mind.

I was going to do Jason's mod which is sort of in a JEL direction, but I now have a 50W JEL style amp on the way so it seems a bit redundant. His Plexi style mods seem quite cool....

 

[la szum]

Marshall uses that killer Cream tolex on the Origin series, and it is the best thing about those amps.

 

[Byrdman]

Marshall uses that killer Cream tolex on the Origin series, and it is the best thing about those amps.

I guess there is an ass for every seat, but I dont care for it. That reminds me of a white non-leather couch, it may look nice new, but if you use it properly and I do mean proper, it's never going to look like that again...

 

[Whizzinby]

Marshall uses that killer Cream tolex on the Origin series, and it is the best thing about those amps.

5153 LBX chilling in the cut ready to consume the Origins soul.

 

[paisleywookiee]

I guess there is an ass for every seat, but I dont care for it. That reminds me of a white non-leather couch, it may look nice new, but if you use it properly and I do mean proper, it's never going to look like that again...

What in gods name are you doing to your amp’s tolex that this is a concern? You can love your amp, just don’t LOVE your amp.

 

[Byrdman]

Green channel of DSL's nail the 2203/jcm800 thing too, just have to set the EQ differently. killer amps

MP, I got a DSL100H about 3 months ago and I am revisiting this thread now that I have had some time with it. I'm close to what you are talking about here. Can you go into more detail on how you set the Eq differently for that 2203 tone? I'm close but it's still just out of reach.

Where I'm falling short, I think and I hope this makes sense, is that I can get real close (but not quite there) on the mid and higher strings, and (what I am hearing) on open power chords it's still super close with that "kraaang" sound, but when I'm barre chords or lower string triads up the neck, it seems to lose a little bit of that bark or something and I think it's what you are talking about with an Eq tweak, but it is still evading me, lol...

Any help, explanations, or tips, are very appreciated! BTW, I love this damn amp and it's got a lot of tones in it, but it has been a little bit of learning curve too especially since it is what I would consider my first real tube amp other than a small 15w combo.

Also using a Marshall 212 with G12-75's and an Epi 59 LP with Gibson Burstbuckers and Toneman 59 wiring kit, so I should be able to get those really good classic/hard rock tones with this setup, and I do, but still wanting to get closer to that 2203 sound if possible.

Funny story, I thought I had the 2203/2204 tone nailed pretty close, and I went and saw a band at a local watering hole and the guitarist had a Marshall 212, LP, and a Marshall amp and was nailing the exact tone I was looking for. In between sets I went to talk to him and he was playing through an SC20H and no pedals. I thought I was close before I heard that guy play and then after I realized I'm still a ways off, talk about deflating your bubble...

Thanks for any suggestions!!

 

[MirrorProfiles]

MP, I got a DSL100H about 3 months ago and I am revisiting this thread now that I have had some time with it. I'm close to what you are talking about here. Can you go into more detail on how you set the Eq differently for that 2203 tone? I'm close but it's still just out of reach.

Where I'm falling short, I think and I hope this makes sense, is that I can get real close (but not quite there) on the mid and higher strings, and (what I am hearing) on open power chords it's still super close with that "kraaang" sound, but when I'm barre chords or lower string triads up the neck, it seems to lose a little bit of that bark or something and I think it's what you are talking about with an Eq tweak, but it is still evading me, lol...

Any help, explanations, or tips, are very appreciated! BTW, I love this damn amp and it's got a lot of tones in it, but it has been a little bit of learning curve too especially since it is what I would consider my first real tube amp other than a small 15w combo.

Also using a Marshall 212 with G12-75's and an Epi 59 LP with Gibson Burstbuckers and Toneman 59 wiring kit, so I should be able to get those really good classic/hard rock tones with this setup, and I do, but still wanting to get closer to that 2203 sound if possible.

Funny story, I thought I had the 2203/2204 tone nailed pretty close, and I went and saw a band at a local watering hole and the guitarist had a Marshall 212, LP, and a Marshall amp and was nailing the exact tone I was looking for. In between sets I went to talk to him and he was playing through an SC20H and no pedals. I thought I was close before I heard that guy play and then after I realized I'm still a ways off, talk about deflating your bubble...

Thanks for any suggestions!!

From memory, you have to set the EQ controls quite a bit higher. They're more responsive and have a slightly wider range. Also gotta pay attention to presence/resonance and volume, and balance those with how the EQ is set.

 

[Byrdman]

From memory, you have to set the EQ controls quite a bit higher. They're more responsive and have a slightly wider range. Also gotta pay attention to presence/resonance and volume, and balance those with how the EQ is set.

I play around with those setting, I have been keeping everything Eq Related around noon with slight +/- adjustments. That may be the ticket right there.

As @GuitarBilly74 said, for Plexi type tones, Eq is in the 1-3 range. Maybe turning Eq settings up to upper end will keep some of the mushy sounds out of the lower strings and get closer to the JCM800 tones.

Thanks for the suggestions and if you think of anything else, feel free to let me know. I'll let you know how it turns out, got to get ready for work. I hate when that work shit gets in the way of important stuff, lol!

 

[GuitarBilly74]

MP, I got a DSL100H about 3 months ago and I am revisiting this thread now that I have had some time with it. I'm close to what you are talking about here. Can you go into more detail on how you set the Eq differently for that 2203 tone? I'm close but it's still just out of reach.

Where I'm falling short, I think and I hope this makes sense, is that I can get real close (but not quite there) on the mid and higher strings, and (what I am hearing) on open power chords it's still super close with that "kraaang" sound, but when I'm barre chords or lower string triads up the neck, it seems to lose a little bit of that bark or something and I think it's what you are talking about with an Eq tweak, but it is still evading me, lol...

Any help, explanations, or tips, are very appreciated! BTW, I love this damn amp and it's got a lot of tones in it, but it has been a little bit of learning curve too especially since it is what I would consider my first real tube amp other than a small 15w combo.

Also using a Marshall 212 with G12-75's and an Epi 59 LP with Gibson Burstbuckers and Toneman 59 wiring kit, so I should be able to get those really good classic/hard rock tones with this setup, and I do, but still wanting to get closer to that 2203 sound if possible.

Funny story, I thought I had the 2203/2204 tone nailed pretty close, and I went and saw a band at a local watering hole and the guitarist had a Marshall 212, LP, and a Marshall amp and was nailing the exact tone I was looking for. In between sets I went to talk to him and he was playing through an SC20H and no pedals. I thought I was close before I heard that guy play and then after I realized I'm still a ways off, talk about deflating your bubble...

Thanks for any suggestions!!

It could be the lower wattage on the SC20 that's allowing him to push the power section a bit more. The classic Marshall tone is more about volume than gain, so with the 100w amps sometimes it's hard to get them in their sweet spot.

When you push the DSL100H to say 4 or 5 on the volume with the gain set relatively low the kerrang is there IMHO but it is probably too loud for most situations. The SC20 gives you a little more flexibility with that.

 

[HomespunEffects]

I always get in trouble when I talk about Marshall amps because it upsets people’s choice-supportive bias.

I was looking for a nice combo when I got back into playing and tried out everything. I ended up getting a DSL40C. I posted about it on TOP™ and got a couple of replies that basically said “ya done effed up because the Origin series is coming out. They’re basically plexis.”

I got worried and fully intended to trade the DSL for an Origin 50. That is until I tried the Origin out. First impression was that it sure ain’t a plexi and the DSL is way more amp with actual Marshall DNA.

Then the reviews from owners started coming out. One phrase always came out as if it couldn’t be helped. “For the price” Is always included in a review of the Origin.

In my opinion the Origin series are glorified practice amps. Not well designed or implemented. The low price doesn’t matter so much when you have to add pedals to get anything useful out of it. Just get a DSL.

 

[HomespunEffects]

Yeah I had the CR, which from what I recall people liked more than the original C version. (But I have no idea if anything about them was meaningfully different)

I kind of prefer the C because the CR had some issues with the microcontroller that switched the channels.

 

[LeftyLoungeLizard]

They're not that far off each other

Have to say it:

The 1987X is not a real plexi, it's a faux-plexi. Just because it has a plexiglass panel does not mean the circuit inside is authentic Plexi.

(not to mention the slight differences in vintage Plexi circuits through the years)

Marshall is well known for "flubbing" their re-issues; often changing cap and resistor values from the original models. The earlier re-issues were really bad in this aspect. They got better over time, but only the handwired Marshalls got the values right IIRC.

This is a real 50W 1968 (1987 model "smallbox") Plexi, and what it sounds like:



Now, I'm not saying the DSL can or cannot do a real Plexi tone (who knows), simply that the 1987X is not a 100% real Plexi circuit nor does it use the same brand or type components ("mustard" caps, for ex) found in real vintage Plexis.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

Have to say it:

The 1987X is not a real plexi, it's a faux-plexi. Just because it has a plexiglass panel does not mean the circuit inside is authentic Plexi.

(not to mention the slight differences in vintage Plexi circuits through the years)

Marshall is well known for "flubbing" their re-issues; often changing cap and resistor values from the original models. The earlier re-issues were really bad in this aspect. They got better over time, but only the handwired Marshalls got the values right IIRC.

This is a real 50W 1968 (1987 model "smallbox") Plexi, and what it sounds like:



Now, I'm not saying the DSL can or cannot do a real Plexi tone (who knows), simply that the 1987X is not a 100% real Plexi circuit nor does it use the same brand or type components ("mustard" caps, for ex) found in real vintage Plexis.

The early reissues (90s) were way off, with 5881s etc... the new ones are pretty close. Johan Segeborn did a pretty good comparison between a '67 and 2 recent reissues. Older Marshalls have a lot of variations anyway.

 

[HomespunEffects]

I have an opinion about the "Tone Shift" button on the DSL. I believe the F is a typo. Leave that button out, guys.

 

[Byrdman]

I always get in trouble when I talk about Marshall amps because it upsets people’s choice-supportive bias.

I was looking for a nice combo when I got back into playing and tried out everything. I ended up getting a DSL40C. I posted about it on TOP™ and got a couple of replies that basically said “ya done effed up because the Origin series is coming out. They’re basically plexis.”

I got worried and fully intended to trade the DSL for an Origin 50. That is until I tried the Origin out. First impression was that it sure ain’t a plexi and the DSL is way more amp with actual Marshall DNA.

Then the reviews from owners started coming out. One phrase always came out as if it couldn’t be helped. “For the price” Is always included in a review of the Origin.

In my opinion the Origin series are glorified practice amps. Not well designed or implemented. The low price doesn’t matter so much when you have to add pedals to get anything useful out of it. Just get a DSL.

I passed on a used Origin 50H for $300. IMO, it did not offer anything additional compared to my DSL. If I get one now, it will probably be just to try out some of the mods Jason @Burger at Headfirst is doing

 

[laxu]

I have an opinion about the "Tone Shift" button on the DSL. I believe the F is a typo. Leave that button out, guys.
View attachment 21536

I've been telling that joke for years!

Also, the preamp board is a secret bouncy castle based on how it flexes when you push in tubes.

 

[Orvillain]

I have an opinion about the "Tone Shift" button on the DSL. I believe the F is a typo. Leave that button out, guys.
View attachment 21536

If you dial in the amp, and THEN hit that switch, and don't re-dial the amp in... then you're just doing it wrong.

It can sound good.

 

[HomespunEffects]

If you dial in the amp, and THEN hit that switch, and don't re-dial the amp in... then you're just doing it wrong.

It can sound good.

In the context of this thread, I disagree. It just sounds less Marshally to me. The tone stack is the character of the amp. Know what i mean? Sure, I can get a tone out of it but not one i enjoy. I totally get where you’re coming from though.

Don’t bogart my Mids, bro.