NAM support announced by Fractal Audio

[SeeD]

This is all good news in my book.

I have been hoping that Fractal and Cliff would offer some kind of profiling/capturing tech for over 10 years.
Then the new Gen Fractal Unit will be able to..
1: make an IR file
2: make a Tone Match of a recording or a song
3: load a NAM capture
This is all good.

But not to be able to make a capture with the device, is not gonna make the new Gen top top notch, as you have to go through the trouble shifting through 'good old' IR file hunt'

But it's better than not having the option.

I own a Quad Cortex (4 or 5 years now) and the really nice thing when i'm making captures, I use the QC as my device. It takes like 5 Minutes to make a capture, and it sounds and feels really good. NAM is possibly a better more real sounding capture, but just to have the option to use the device when making captures is really fun and really nice.

The next gen devices need to have both Modelling and Capture Tech. This is a step in the right Direction.

It will be interesting to see if Line 6 makes a really good capture with Proxy, and if it really can capture effects as well, this will be fun to see!

 

[LP59]

To circle back, I think it’s unreasonable to armchair manage their dev time and resources because you don’t like a particular feature.

I think what's going is people want to influence Cliff's prioritization by speaking up in favor of their pet enhancements and, since it's zero sum game, condemning all other feature requests. That latter behavior of shitting on other people's ideas has always been a common theme on the forum and gives the forum a negative flavor.

Ultimately I think you're right, it indicates a lack of trust in Cliff's ability to manage his products.

 

[ChordInversion]

I think what's going is people want to influence Cliff's prioritization by speaking up in favor of their pet enhancements and, since it's zero sum game, condemning all other feature requests. That latter behavior of shitting on other people's ideas has always been a common theme on the forum and gives the forum a negative flavor.

Which is what every single person who has ever described profiling/capture as "table stakes" has been doing.

Or...nobody has been doing it. We're all just saying "I like [X], and would therefore prefer if it got/kept priority,' and it need not be villainized because you don't like one subset of people who are doing it.

Ultimately I think you're right, it indicates a lack of trust in Cliff's ability to manage his products.

Nonsense. There's no trust involved one way or the other. It's his company, and he can and will do (and has done) whatever he wants with it, as well he should. We're all agreed that with adding NAM support in the future, he is responding to what some people have said that they want. They've said they want NAM/profiling in general. People who aren't into NAM and want other things to take precedence are allowed to say so, too.

 

[Tanax]

I’ll tell you this: I was using NAM extensively before TONEX released the V2 upgrade to their capturing tech. Since then, I haven’t used NAM at all. IK Multimedia has achieved nearly identical quality with a much simpler and more convenient capture process, plus faster processing time.

Precisely, it's the interface and usability of NAM that makes it harder to use than competitors. Adding it to Fractal would make it immensely easier to use for people IMO. If Fractal can also include capturing capabilities, that would be even better, but I guess that's still undecided.

 

[Shask]

I’ll tell you this: I was using NAM extensively before TONEX released the V2 upgrade to their capturing tech. Since then, I haven’t used NAM at all. IK Multimedia has achieved nearly identical quality with a much simpler and more convenient capture process, plus faster processing time.

I have tried to get into NAM, but ToneX has just spoken to me far more. The Ecosystem makes it way easier to work with.

 

[Chocol8]

Saying capture tech is table stakes is stating one’s view of the market place, not a demand and not belittling those who don’t want it. I believe that the only two players that MIGHT have survived without it were Line 6 and Fractal, but it was starting to seem like they would both risk losing sales without it. Prior to Cliff’s announcement, people were actively talking about selling Fractal gear and going to Stadium, and Proxy is still a complete unknown!!!

The fact that they both announced upcoming support within 6 months of each other, suggests that they both think it’s an important feature from a competitive point of view. I get that some people don’t want or need it, but like it or not, capture support IS becoming like IR support. It doesn’t matter how good your built in cabs are, almost all the players support third party IR’s and a large portion of the customer base simply expects that. That’s the reality for capture tech in 2026 or 2027 at the latest.

If you want more bad news, I honestly think component modeling is a dying tech. It won’t go away, but it will be a shrinking niche. I see Line 6 and Fractal keeping it front and center, but for smaller and low budget players, the time and cost to develop the tech and the models is going to be harder and harder to justify when machine learning can make profiles/captures so easily.

The idea that the tone controls must behave exactly like the real amp is a huge red herring. Most new buyers will have no idea how the controls on the real amp react, and most of the rest will only be familiar with a small number of real amps. They need tools to take a capture that is close to what they need and make small adjustments, and that exists already. It works far far better than a lot of people realize, so no, you really don’t need to find THE perfect capture, you just need one in the ball park. For the vast majority, getting a good tone will be what matters. Plus, for those who do care, capture tech is going to solve that “problem” as well anyway with dynamic captures or whatever you want to call it. Again, a little AI programming and a few servos to twist pots will be able to capture the full range of an amps tonal possibilities in a fraction of the time and at a fraction of the cost of adding a new amp model. That’s not 10 years from now, it’s something people are working on today.

 

[timbuck3]

The new units will have enough power for any evolution that occurs. Remember this: what Fractal is coming out with will make many current products look like Game Boys

Well, you could argue. They all look like gay boys when they have a big screen. I don’t get what that comment meant though because if Cliff puts a big screen with touchscreen with knobs under it, it’s gonna look like a game boy as well so when he says others will look like a game boy it seems like he’s putting others down butI guess I just don’t understand what he means

 

[Dimiguitar]

Well, you could argue. They all look like gay boys when they have a big screen.

 

[timbuck3]

Saying capture tech is table stakes is stating one’s view of the market place, not a demand and not belittling those who don’t want it. I believe that the only two players that MIGHT have survived without it were Line 6 and Fractal, but it was starting to seem like they would both risk losing sales without it. Prior to Cliff’s announcement, people were actively talking about selling Fractal gear and going to Stadium, and Proxy is still a complete unknown!!!

The fact that they both announced upcoming support within 6 months of each other, suggests that they both think it’s an important feature from a competitive point of view. I get that some people don’t want or need it, but like it or not, capture support IS becoming like IR support. It doesn’t matter how good your built in cabs are, almost all the players support third party IR’s and a large portion of the customer base simply expects that. That’s the reality for capture tech in 2026 or 2027 at the latest.

If you want more bad news, I honestly think component modeling is a dying tech. It won’t go away, but it will be a shrinking niche. I see Line 6 and Fractal keeping it front and center, but for smaller and low budget players, the time and cost to develop the tech and the models is going to be harder and harder to justify when machine learning can make profiles/captures so easily.

The idea that the tone controls must behave exactly like the real amp is a huge red herring. Most new buyers will have no idea how the controls on the real amp react, and most of the rest will only be familiar with a small number of real amps. They need tools to take a capture that is close to what they need and make small adjustments, and that exists already. It works far far better than a lot of people realize, so no, you really don’t need to find THE perfect capture, you just need one in the ball park. For the vast majority, getting a good tone will be what matters. Plus, for those who do care, capture tech is going to solve that “problem” as well anyway with dynamic captures or whatever you want to call it. Again, a little AI programming and a few servos to twist pots will be able to capture the full range of an amps tonal possibilities in a fraction of the time and at a fraction of the cost of adding a new amp model. That’s not 10 years from now, it’s something people are working on today.

I don’t think fractal or Line 6 are really worried about sales of their units as they seem to have the top position, in flagship modelers. I guess it’s more like who can come out with the more things that the modular can do I mean fractals already there with so many models and effects, but they need to work on their drives as people have stated.
It seems like the real thing that’s lacking on fractals in general as the interface cliff could just release the FM nine with a more slick interface, and it would sell like hotcakes without even touching the effects in the tones… which is pretty much what line 6 is doing, but they’re building into their release 10 years worth of software innovations that are still yet to come

 

[paisleywookiee]

They all look like gay boys

 

[timbuck3]

This is all good news in my book.

I have been hoping that Fractal and Cliff would offer some kind of profiling/capturing tech for over 10 years.
Then the new Gen Fractal Unit will be able to..
1: make an IR file
2: make a Tone Match of a recording or a song
3: load a NAM capture
This is all good.

But not to be able to make a capture with the device, is not gonna make the new Gen top top notch, as you have to go through the trouble shifting through 'good old' IR file hunt'

But it's better than not having the option.

I own a Quad Cortex (4 or 5 years now) and the really nice thing when i'm making captures, I use the QC as my device. It takes like 5 Minutes to make a capture, and it sounds and feels really good. NAM is possibly a better more real sounding capture, but just to have the option to use the device when making captures is really fun and really nice.

The next gen devices need to have both Modelling and Capture Tech. This is a step in the right Direction.

It will be interesting to see if Line 6 makes a really good capture with Proxy, and if it really can capture effects as well, this will be fun to see!

Line 6 is definitely the leader in innovation at this point and now that people know their track record on the helix they likely won’t be so quick to return the item if it doesn’t sound the way they want to sound when they get it because they know that 10 years is built into that for software updates, maybe more

 

[timbuck3]

Geez. I am cracking myself up … sorry

 

[AlbertA]

Some of you guys are nucking futs.

 

[AlbertA]

Well, you could argue. They all look like gay boys when they have a big screen. I don’t get what that comment meant though because if Cliff puts a big screen with touchscreen with knobs under it, it’s gonna look like a game boy as well so when he says others will look like a game boy it seems like he’s putting others down butI guess I just don’t understand what he means

 

[Dom Mcsweeney]

as the open-source code changes, won’t you have to now keep up with that. Being dependent on ever evolving open-source code seems like it might come with its own share of challenges…. But maybe it’s not that big of a deal??

No, developers building with NAM don't need to update/sync changes unless they feel it important to do so.
They can either fork the NAM core repository, or just download the source code as a zip, then build products as they please.
So, it's not a big deal at all.

 

[Mike Oliphant]

But (and I don’t know much about the underlying code), building your device on open source code seems like it would introduce some other challenges. Now, not only do you have to focus on your own tech bug fixes and feature enhancements, but as the open-source code changes, won’t you have to now keep up with that.

The NAM file format (ie: what you need to be compatible with) hasn't had breaking changes in years.

 

[ian_dissonance]

Whether it’s to my interest or not, a major hardware manufacturer supporting NAM will probably do more for NAM users than it will Axe FX users.

 

[[Nathan]]

I have an email/calendaring/file sharing account with a service. They've pivoted toward putting a lot of energy into things like crypto wallets and 'AI' writing assistants. I don't like those priorities, as there are still lots of features to add to their core products.

I take the totality of your response and get the overall sentiment, I think we (and a lot of people) mostly agree on 8/10 things.
On your point above... Adobe Photoshop recently upped the pricing of the lightroom+photoshop bundle +52% $$$ / month. Ontop of that they keep adding AI features that will start to use credits, so if you're a power user you'll be up for even more when you exhaust your allotment per month. At the very least these features are crazy powerful and pure insanity for the photo editing world, but the writing is on the wall with all this stuff, higher fees, more AI (yuck)

Two guys I play with all the time use Kempers.

One last lol, they can finally move to Fractal when profiling is on an equal sized unit

 

[[Nathan]]

They all look like gay boys when they have a big screen.

 

[KHAAAAAAANNNNNNN!!!!!!!!]