Kemper Profiler MK 2

The Kemper always had its own feel and tone. If the profiles you like were from amps with similar characteristics you would probably like it and actually think it’s more accurate than it actually is.
Also you couldn’t really alter anything or accurate was going away quickly. Make your own profiles and ABY using the cab it was created with without moving it and it gets a whole lot closer and can actually get very close to indistinguishable from the amp. This is a bunch of ifs and buts but it is why imo people’s experience with the original vary so much. No doubt I will buy the 2 and go through it all again . The other thing worth mentioning is a power rack in the UK / Europe is pretty cheap for what you get.
 
The Kemper always had its own feel and tone. If the profiles you like were from amps with similar characteristics you would probably like it and actually think it’s more accurate than it actually is.
Also you couldn’t really alter anything or accurate was going away quickly. Make your own profiles and ABY using the cab it was created with without moving it and it gets a whole lot closer and can actually get very close to indistinguishable from the amp. This is a bunch of ifs and buts but it is why imo people’s experience with the original vary so much. No doubt I will buy the 2 and go through it all again . The other thing worth mentioning is a power rack in the UK / Europe is pretty cheap for what you get.
If the 2 is NAM levels of accuracy, I will buy one.

My Drewslov's Hierarchy of First World Needs for a digital modeller or profiler/capture type box:

- It needs to sound and feel like an amp. Any amp. But an amp.
- It needs to have exceptional audio quality - aliasing should be minimal, oversampling should be done where needed, and the overall impression should be one of clarity, presence, punch; a 3D 'life like' impression of an amp tone. To use a bunch of buzz words.
- In the case of profiling or capturing, it should be as close to 1:1 against the reference amp as possible.
- It should not alter the input signal in any negative way whatsoever - this includes avoiding spectral FFT based processes that sit in the audio processing path; using it for a spectral noise gate, where the FFT only processes the sidechain (presumably) is acceptable to me.
- It should natively run at 48kHz - primarily because that's how I run my entire system, and if I'm connecting to the unit digitally, I just want it all to work without clocking issues.
- It should have digital connections - preferably AES/EBU.

Pretty much everything else, I am negotiable on.
 
@AFKAEjay(retired) - this is what I get when I post sincere and polite responses to people. So... please tell me why I should bother; coz you are extremely fond of calling me out by stealth, yet you never call these kinds of people out. Why tone police me, and not other people?

As to the claim that the evidence is to the contrary... doesn't even warrant a response. It is just stupid, and the entire planet has just lost half an IQ point because of it.


I've got 18 years of gigging under my belt too. But you'll just come back with another stupid response to that, is my guess. You're an extremely bad faith person.


Aliasing is not a per-rig phenomenon. It is a product of the entire DSP system. It is genuinely hilarious that you think you can avoid it by just avoiding certain rigs. You reveal your ignorance once again.


Well, firstly, it isn't off subject. It is precisely what we're talking about.




Aliasing happens when you apply non-linear processes to a signal, that create overtones or harmonics. These harmonics extend out from the fundamental, up through the frequency range. When they hit Nyquist, if they're not dealt with, they will wrap around and cause unpleasant chipmunk or squirrel artefacts. In the case of the Kemper - as the video I linked earlier shows - they're extremely audible.

How do you handle aliasing? You filter. How do you filter? There are a range of techniques. One of them is to apply a FIR filter just below the Nyquist frequency, so that frequencies above bounce back and get filtered before they have a chance to be audible.

Another way is to perform an FFT on the signal, attenuate or zero out bins that fall above a certain threshold, and then inverse FFT it back. This method, while computationally more expensive, can offer precise control over the frequency domain and is often used in convolution-style processes or spectral shaping tools.

But most importantly — and here's where many profiling and modeling systems fall short — the best way to mitigate aliasing is to oversample the non-linear process before it generates the alias-prone content. You run your distortion (or other non-linear effect) at, say, 4x or 8x the sample rate, then filter and downsample it back. This dramatically reduces foldback aliasing.

It is way more involved than simply saying "run at 48kHz and everything will be fine".

So to answer your question:
=> IR block - very low risk of aliasing being introduced here.

=> Delay Blocks - moderate risk of aliasing here, depending on how the delay line interpolation works and the non-linearities added in the circuit.

=> Reverb Block - same as the delay block; there's a possibility you could introduce aliasing here if you don't support fractional delay times within the feedback paths used to create the reverb.

=> EQ- very low risk of aliasing being introduced here.

=> MultiBand Comp - There could be some risk here, depending on non-linearities and the design of the crossover filters.

=> Flanger / Phaser - Same sort of thing as the delay and reverb blocks; if you're modulating delay lines, then you could introduce aliasing.


Using band-limited interpolation techniques and oversampling within the blocks where delay lines are modulated, is how you would address any potential sources of aliasing.

I know there's lot of banter and stuff that goes on here on TGF - but genuinely, thanks for such a detailed explanation that even a total non-techy like me could wrap their brain around. Very much appreciated :)
 
+1 on the value of that aliasing explanation from Orvillain. Injecting this sort of analysis into the discussion can help clear up some confusion and dispel some myths. I have no doubt that the people who are building all these toys for us have a fair grasp of that material but it is not often discussed in the marketing blerb ;-)
 
I know there's lot of banter and stuff that goes on here on TGF - but genuinely, thanks for such a detailed explanation that even a total non-techy like me could wrap their brain around. Very much appreciated :)
No problem. I've been working in the area of delay lines, resampling, and FFT analysis recently, so I've been learning quite a lot.

How you interpolate data points is critical to the final sound quality and character of any system that utilises delay lines.

If I was to be super charitable, I would say that preferring the sound of the Kemper over Helix and Axe FX III, is akin to preferring the sound of an 80's rack delay over a newer unit from Strymon; because almost certainly the 80's digital rack delay won't have implemented high quality resampling algorithms, whereas the Strymon would have. The older rack unit would alias to high heaven (just as the Kemper does), but some people don't care, and it can certainly add to the character of a unit. I just personally don't think it adds very much to a guitar rig.

There's obviously objective and subjective things when it comes to a comparison like that. I wouldn't argue for putting all the value in one of these realms and ignoring the other; both are important.

PS: Not all aliasing is down to interpolation I would add, and obviously it is a lot more complex than what I've summarized. But as a highlight point about aliasing, I think that will suffice.
 
Also this is a guitar amp so the only thing that actually matters is do you like the sound and feel.
It’s more than that. On playback to the player it’s a digital amp that should respond and feel like the original capture.

But that doesn’t have much to do with capturing accuracy. You can have one without the other, you ideally want to strive for both not just one.
 
I'm pretty torn on the Player. After a few days it sounds and feels pretty good and it's a fun little device. But the $300 paywall to unlock features is really grating. I'd love to try some of the other effects to see if it's worth it, but there's no trial period. I have a return policy on the unit but there's no refunds on the upgrades. The upgrades are locked to the serial number, so even if I did return it and then get a new one, I would have to pay another $300. If it gets lost or stolen, you have to pay another $300. It's just really dumb.

And now they've expanded features from the paywall and dropped the price, so I'm even more cautious about dropping $300 for something that might end up being free or reduced cost in six months.

If I end up bailing on the Player, it's going to 100% be because of that stupid tiered paywall that doesn't need to exist.
 
I'm pretty torn on the Player. After a few days it sounds and feels pretty good and it's a fun little device. But the $300 paywall to unlock features is really grating. I'd love to try some of the other effects to see if it's worth it, but there's no trial period. I have a return policy on the unit but there's no refunds on the upgrades. The upgrades are locked to the serial number, so even if I did return it and then get a new one, I would have to pay another $300. If it gets lost or stolen, you have to pay another $300. It's just really dumb.

And now they've expanded features from the paywall and dropped the price, so I'm even more cautious about dropping $300 for something that might end up being free or reduced cost in six months.

If I end up bailing on the Player, it's going to 100% be because of that stupid tiered paywall that doesn't need to exist.
What effects do you feel are missing most in the base package?
 
What effects do you feel are missing most in the base package?

Kemper Drive, Hyper Chorus, Micro Pitch, Dual Delay, and Natural Reverb.

Also, only having two effect slots after the amp is pretty limiting. You basically want to have reverb on everything, which means you can't have stereo delay and stereo chorus. The fixed effect block Air Chorus is pretty underwhelming with the lack of options.

It would be awesome if you could pick where the A and B blocks were on the base Player (before vs after amp). It has the capability of doing that, but it's locked.
 
Kemper Drive, Hyper Chorus, Micro Pitch, Dual Delay, and Natural Reverb.

Also, only having two effect slots after the amp is pretty limiting. You basically want to have reverb on everything, which means you can't have stereo delay and stereo chorus. The fixed effect block Air Chorus is pretty underwhelming with the lack of options.

It would be awesome if you could pick where the A and B blocks were on the base Player (before vs after amp). It has the capability of doing that, but it's locked.
I know it isn't ideal still but could you just do the Tier 2 and get what you need it's $129 vs $300 (I think)

Still obviously not ideal
 
I'm pretty torn on the Player. After a few days it sounds and feels pretty good and it's a fun little device. But the $300 paywall to unlock features is really grating. I'd love to try some of the other effects to see if it's worth it, but there's no trial period. I have a return policy on the unit but there's no refunds on the upgrades. The upgrades are locked to the serial number, so even if I did return it and then get a new one, I would have to pay another $300. If it gets lost or stolen, you have to pay another $300. It's just really dumb.

And now they've expanded features from the paywall and dropped the price, so I'm even more cautious about dropping $300 for something that might end up being free or reduced cost in six months.

If I end up bailing on the Player, it's going to 100% be because of that stupid tiered paywall that doesn't need to exist.
My proces: A dual delay is an “always use” item for me, so lvl2 was a musthave for me.
At the time the fixed efx were not there, and I use a clean boost post amp, delay and verb…so lvl3 was a musthave also. Not sure if i would do that again with the fixed efx there, but…I calculate costs over the expected use in years…that makes 150,- a few steps smaller ;). Regardless, I think lvl3 is a bit thin atm…I wouldn’t be surprised if they dodge that one in the future.

Then it was a matter of “is there another unit on the market that can do the same at that price”?..and for my requirement list that was a “no”, so I went for it.

It would be awesome if you could pick where the A and B blocks were on the base Player. It has the capability of doing that, but it's locked.
I don’t think so, I can’t move A and B blocks on a level III player, neither can I on the toaster.
 
No one ever said any profile or capture was 100% accurate.
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My proces: A dual delay is an “always use” item for me, so lvl2 was a musthave for me.
At the time the fixed efx were not there, and I use a clean boost post amp, delay and verb…so lvl3 was a musthave also. Not sure if i would do that again with the fixed efx there, but…I calculate costs over the expected use in years…that makes 150,- a few steps smaller ;). Regardless, I think lvl3 is a bit thin atm…I wouldn’t be surprised if they dodge that one in the future.

Then it was a matter of “is there another unit on the market that can do the same at that price”?..and for my requirement list that was a “no”, so I went for it.


I don’t think so, I can’t move A and B blocks on a level III player, neither can I on the toaster.

Yep, I could totally see the 2 and 3 being near essential.

I mean I do have the Axe FX 3, so I'm trying to get some of that feel and tone of the Kemper profiles I like on that because it's so damn powerful. There's definitely something sweet about the Kemper sometimes that makes it really enjoyable to play.

I could stretch $700 to have a mini Kemper around for fun...stretching $1000 to have a mini Kemper is definitely more of a stretch.
 
Some quotes from SW Kemper Mkii page

"Moreover, the MK 2 update marks a major leap forward in profiling technology, elevating Kemper’s industry-leading digital emulations to a trailblazing new level of sonic precision."

"The Profiler MK 2 series raises the bar on profiling precision, enhancing Kemper’s industry-leading emulation with a smattering of cutting-edge technologies. Profiles now analyze more than 100,000 individual frequency points to deliver the highest level of sonic accuracy possible, while Kemper’s Liquid Profiling transforms your profiles with gain and tone controls to capture the dynamic feel of tweaking a physical amplifier. Moreover, the MK 2 update features dynamically adjustable speaker and cabinet resonance to further sharpen the fidelity of your impulse responses."
 
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