I can’t get away from tube amps…

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Bob Zaod said:
I did use a Rage at one point as a distortion pedal! It brought DA BROOTZ!
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I owned it myself! lol Was my first amp! I would love to run across one in the used section at GC to play for old times sake.
 
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I have an origin 20h and honestly there are so many Marshall’s I’d recommend over it. At best it can sound OK, but it’s a dumb circuit IMO. It’s a rubbish master volume because if you want a gainy tone then you need it cranked, at which point it’s very loud. The circuit has too few gain stages to feel like a Marshall, and yet they wasted an entire 12ax7 for the fx loop (why they didn’t use a good solid state loop and use the valve for a gain stage is beyond me).

Vintage Modern and DSL’s are up there with ANY marshall out there. If you want something small that is good at different volumes, Friedman offer way better circuits for the money.
 
MirrorProfiles said:
I have an origin 20h and honestly there are so many Marshall’s I’d recommend over it. At best it can sound OK, but it’s a dumb circuit IMO. It’s a rubbish master volume because if you want a gainy tone then you need it cranked, at which point it’s very loud. The circuit has too few gain stages to feel like a Marshall, and yet they wasted an entire 12ax7 for the fx loop (why they didn’t use a good solid state loop and use the valve for a gain stage is beyond me).

Vintage Modern and DSL’s are up there with ANY marshall out there. If you want something small that is good at different volumes, Friedman offer way better circuits for the money.
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Under your username it says "Shredder".
So I'm guessing you're basically a metal player, favouring high gain amps. Correct me if I'm wrong.

The Origin is not a high gain amp. It's not a JCM, DSL, etc. It's voiced to sound more like the early JTM's.
If high gain is your thing then don't get the Origin.
If you want the early plexi crunch, the Origin will get you in that ballpark.
It's definately not an "ok" amp.
By the way, the 50watt Origin sounds way better than the 20. I tried a 20, then bought the 50. Wish I still had it.
 
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Zodiac said:
Under your username it says "Shredder".
So I'm guessing you're basically a metal player, favouring high gain amps. Correct me if I'm wrong.
The Origin is not a high gain amp. It's not a JCM, DSL, etc. It's voiced to sound more like the early JMP's.
If high gain is your thing then don't get the Origin.
If you want the early plexi crunch, the Origin will get you in that ballpark.
It's definately not an "ok" amp.
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The Shredder thing is just a forum quirk of how many posts you've had, unless you identify as a Groupie :) I am certainly not a shredder.

My point above still stands - the Origin amp doesn't have enough gain stages to sound quite like an old JTM or JMP, unless you mod it and repurpose the valve driven FX loop. The Vintage Modern is MUCH closer to a stock JTM45 with some additional optional extras. The features allow it to sound very authentic at full volume, or you can use the PPIMV and mods to get a range of tones at lower volumes. The Origin sounds OK, but ultimately, not as good as it could had the circuit been closer to what a traditional Marshall preamp does.

Origin's are much cleaner than a JTM or Plexi, and will only get in the ballpark once the master is cranked up loud. It's very loud at that point and not particularly pleasant. Once you have it up cranked, the FX loop is going to get distorted too and becomes less useful, so all the compromises in the amp design become moot.

Likewise, IMO the DSL's are at least equal to sounding like a JMP as well as having a better MV circuit and more useable tones across the whole spectrum. The Origin doesn't do anything better than other amps, the design is weird and doesn't really make sense.
 
The points you make are valid.
As someone who has owned Plexis, JCM 800's, and the Origin 50, all I'm saying is don't write off the Origin as a badly designed amp.
🖐️
 
Zodiac said:
The points you make are valid.
As someone who has owned Plexis, JCM 800's, and the Origin 50, all I'm saying is don't write off the Origin as a badly designed amp.
🖐️
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I'm not saying that you can't get useable tones out of it, or that it isn't enjoyable. I just think its a poor choice of amp to go for when there are many other Marshall's that cover the same ground (and much more). I still own a lot of Marshalls old and new, and the origin is probably the only one I wouldn't recommend UNLESS its to use as a donor to mod.

2 of these cost £1100, all others less than £1000 and often around £500 or less

- JMP 2203
- JMP 2104 (2204 combo)
- JMP 4104 (JCM 800 era 2204 combo)
- 1981 JCM 800 2204
- 1989 JCM 800 2204
- 1989 JCM 800 2210
- 1988 2554 Jubilee
- JMP 4145 Club and Country
- JMP 2144
- JMP 2150
- 1959HW
- JMP 1992 Super Bass
- DSL 100H
- JCM2000 DSL 100
- Vintage Modern 2266
- Valvestate 8100
- Valvestate 8080 Combo
- Origin 20H


Its quite interesting to read/listen to what one of the designers of the Origin has said about what the amp started out as in the design process and what it finally got released as. The design changed as it slipped through other peoples hands and the original intention of the circuit got confused along the way. IMO the design is poor, because:

- an entire 12ax7 (2 gain stages) is sacrificed for an FX loop. This means it is 1 valve short of what a standard JTM45 or 1987/1959 preamp has to work with.
- the resulting lack of gain stages mean the only way to get crunch is to turn up the MV volume
- at this point, the amp is VERY loud, and the FX loop will be getting distorted by the PI and power amp and sounds like mush.

So it may as well have just been a standard JTM45 or 1987 type circuit in the first place. There's enough examples of them sounding good, and I'm not saying they sound terrible or have no use. I'm glad you dig yours and I'm not taking anything away from that. I just think other amps offer much more than the Origin at much better value
 
metropolis_4 said:
Why do they sound so much better? Why can’t I stop thinking about them?

I keep replaying that scene in Parks & Rec when they have the hamburger cook off.

I spend all this time dialing in my digital rig and I’m so excited about how good it sounds.

Then I flip on a lowly Marshall Origin at a shop in between shows and immediately it sounds 100x better with zero effort…

Guitar Center has 48 month financing on Marshall’s right now… I think I’m gonna have to pick something up

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I love this clip, because for me it’s true regarding amps and hamburgers. I love a real hamburger and a tube amp, but for practicality and healths sake most of my life is digital and Beyond burgers.

Also, the Origin is the same amp I go for every time I’m at GC. But I can do so much more with my digital gear, and I actually do utilize that functionality.
 
MirrorProfiles said:
I'm not saying that you can't get useable tones out of it, or that it isn't enjoyable. I just think its a poor choice of amp to go for when there are many other Marshall's that cover the same ground (and much more). I still own a lot of Marshalls old and new, and the origin is probably the only one I wouldn't recommend UNLESS its to use as a donor to mod.

2 of these cost £1100, all others less than £1000 and often around £500 or less

- JMP 2203
- JMP 2104 (2204 combo)
- JMP 4104 (JCM 800 era 2204 combo)
- 1981 JCM 800 2204
- 1989 JCM 800 2204
- 1989 JCM 800 2210
- 1988 2554 Jubilee
- JMP 4145 Club and Country
- JMP 2144
- JMP 2150
- 1959HW
- JMP 1992 Super Bass
- DSL 100H
- JCM2000 DSL 100
- Vintage Modern 2266
- Valvestate 8100
- Valvestate 8080 Combo
- Origin 20H


Its quite interesting to read/listen to what one of the designers of the Origin has said about what the amp started out as in the design process and what it finally got released as. The design changed as it slipped through other peoples hands and the original intention of the circuit got confused along the way. IMO the design is poor, because:

- an entire 12ax7 (2 gain stages) is sacrificed for an FX loop. This means it is 1 valve short of what a standard JTM45 or 1987/1959 preamp has to work with.
- the resulting lack of gain stages mean the only way to get crunch is to turn up the MV volume
- at this point, the amp is VERY loud, and the FX loop will be getting distorted by the PI and power amp and sounds like mush.

So it may as well have just been a standard JTM45 or 1987 type circuit in the first place. There's enough examples of them sounding good, and I'm not saying they sound terrible or have no use. I'm glad you dig yours and I'm not taking anything away from that. I just think other amps offer much more than the Origin at much better value
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Is there a good link to read about the origin of the Origin? I thought the whole point of it was to be mostly clean as a “pedal platform” because “pedal platform” was the buzzy catch phrase 10 years ago.
 
ragingplatypi said:
Is there a good link to read about the origin of the Origin? I thought the whole point of it was to be mostly clean as a “pedal platform” because “pedal platform” was the buzzy catch phrase 10 years ago.
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There’s various posts/youtube videos from Santiago talking about it, as well as just looking at the schematic and amp itself to see what’s going on.

It’s fine as a pedal platform (much more useful used with pedals than without), but so are a lot of amps. I recently picked up a JMP4145 and that wipes the floor with it as a pedal platform IMO. Even if you ONLY wanted a pedal platform, I’m not sure what it offers over other amps they’ve made.
 
MirrorProfiles said:
There’s various posts/youtube videos from Santiago talking about it, as well as just looking at the schematic and amp itself to see what’s going on.

It’s fine as a pedal platform (much more useful used with pedals than without), but so are a lot of amps. I recently picked up a JMP4145 and that wipes the floor with it as a pedal platform IMO. Even if you ONLY wanted a pedal platform, I’m not sure what it offers over other amps they’ve made.
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Thanks. I’ll check it out.

As someone who could never bond with a DSL, the Origin offers the price point.
 
Zodiac said:
The points you make are valid.
As someone who has owned Plexis, JCM 800's, and the Origin 50, all I'm saying is don't write off the Origin as a badly designed amp.
🖐️
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Also the 20 and 50 are almost black and white comparatively. I couldnt tell you why but the 50 definitely has more depth and and more of that "bark" that everyone talks about for Marshalls. I have a/b'd them for many hours through the same 2x12 of V30's to reach that conclusion. back when I had my first 50H I bought them both to compare. The 20 sounds like a toy compared to the 50, at least in the room it does. No offense to anyone who has the 20
 
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Got my Origin 20H back today, maybe I was being a bit harsh on it. Not that I ever thought it sounds bad but it sounds much better than I remembered.

I would still say though that its an odd circuit, it has the bones of a killer affordable amp. To get those Plexi tones from it, you need the master up really high at which point its REALLY loud. I also would have been fine with a LND150 type FX loop and used the extra valve for a more "true" plexi circuit, or another mode or something. They're so cheap on the used market (especially given how expensive valves have become) that I can't be critical at all ha.
 
Bob Zaod said:
Also the 20 and 50 are almost black and white comparatively. I couldnt tell you why but the 50 definitely has more depth and and more of that "bark" that everyone talks about for Marshalls. I have a/b'd them for many hours through the same 2x12 of V30's to reach that conclusion. back when I had my first 50H I bought them both to compare. The 20 sounds like a toy compared to the 50, at least in the room it does. No offense to anyone who has the 20
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Just to add to this also now that I have had the 2nd 50H for a spell. It's one of the loudest 50w tube amps I have ever had. I am gonna have to dig out my attenuator. It's one of those Bugera Jettenuator clones but it works good. Shit it handled my Tremoverb with no problems and thats a task in itself.
 
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