How do the deal with the loudness?

[mercifulfuzziness]

Sometimes I am watching that pedal show… and I am just really wondering .. how do these guys leave the room not with their ears ringing like crazy?

It almost hurts watching them or is that me being a wuss? I can take it if that’s the case. I don’t mean this literally, more like: damn .. 104 db constantly? Yikes. Marshall cranked? Yikes. In most situations it just stays around 99 to 104. It rarely is in the 80-90db range.

Case in example… super reverb vs deluxe reverb … they are testing how it sound cranked up. They get to level 7 … Dan is playing away maybe a meter away from those amps… the DB meter spiking at 103…
But even worse … Mick is IN FRONT OF THE AMPS tweaking away on those amps…

That would make me hurt even for 30 seconds?

 

[jellodog]

Traditional guitar cabs are "beamy". The TPD guys usually keep their ears well above and outside the beam (Mick does this when he's near the amp and cab adjusting things).

That said, with the general sound pressure levels that I've observed in that room, I'd be suprised if those guys didn't have at least a little hearing damage by now.

I reckon that I've probably gotten more damage from a heavy-hitting drummer's cymbals at ear level, rather than guitar cabs. Those bastards!

 

[Alex Kenivel]

Yeah, I know it's loud but it sounds good.

See also: what did you say?

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

Yeah, I know it's loud but it sounds good.

See also: what did you say?

 

[Eagle]

Everyone used to do that. In the past I have used a plexi on full about five feet away from the cabs . TBH you can’t really hear it at all but you certainly could feel it. Obviously it was very bad for your hearing long term but in the 80s nobody bothered.
The loudest gig I ever saw was Motörhead at the Marquee. It was an invitation only and my friend and I spent the whole time sat at the bar laughing. Lemmy came over after and asked if we enjoyed it. I was still laughing. Nobody got anything except white noise. He was hilarious he said that was how he got gigs .

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

Yeah, I know it's loud but it sounds good.

See also: what did you say?

I YouTubed “what did you say that pedal show” and searched the gear forum. Couldn’t find a thing.

 

[jellodog]

The loudest gig I ever saw was Motörhead at the Marquee. [...]
Lemmy came over after and asked if we enjoyed it. I was still laughing. Nobody got anything except white noise. He was hilarious he said that was how he got gigs.

Funny you should mention that!

I saw Motörhead circa 1989 and I usually tell people that was the loudest gig I ever attended. Great gig; exciting. But unfortunately I probably was "in the beam". My ears were ringing for a week. I was at the front of the stage and their amp stacks were louder than the PA!

Suspect that did some damage.

Also met Lemmy in the bar afterwards... I was 19 years old. Too young, scared and nervous to say much and only managed a few words; but he was friendly and engaging. Nice fella.

Other loudest gig was the notoriously loud My Bloody Valentine, a year or two later at Reading University.

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

Funny you should mention that!

I saw Motörhead circa 1989 and I usually tell people that was the loudest gig I ever attended. My ears were ringing for a week. I was at the front of the stage and their amp stacks were louder than the PA!

Suspect that did some damage.

Also met Lemmy in the bar afterwards... I was 19 years old. Too young, scared and nervous to say much and only managed a few words; but he was friendly and engaging. Nice fella.

Other loudest gig was the notoriously loud My Bloody Valentine, a year or two later at Reading University.

I mean, when I still did gigs we where mostly in a a “speakers next to you on stage and just enjoy the bass inside your body” but I was young and when you are young you can deal with that stuff better. I also wasn’t doing a show every week 1-2 times. Mostly once a month or so.

Going to shows I rarely was at the front. Because I dislike people around me lol so that probably saved me because I have no hearing issues yet.

So it’s not to judge. But what That Pedal Show does seem to be very ehmmm irresponsible?

 

[Humbug]

It's not _that_ loud. I mean, an AC30 is barely loud enough to drown out the squealing background noise that's everywhere these days.

 

[laxu]

It depends a lot on the space. The bigger the space, the less you hear the sound bouncing immediately from the walls, and things like curtains, carpets etc can help dissipate the sound too. A small room with plain concrete walls? That gets painfully loud real quick.

With guitar cabs being highly directional, it actually sounds less loud standing right in front of the amp when tweaking it, than a few meters away. I need to stand a couple meters away from my slanted 4x10 to really hear it in its full glory. It also has beam blockers on its top speakers so less harsh highs hitting my ears, so it doesn't sound perceivedly that loud even though I've sometimes measured 100+ dB volumes when I get to play it loud.

I've honestly found some stadium gigs a lot more troublesome. I remember seeing Muse and everything had this "kshshhshshs" sizzle on top of it until I put in my earplugs that attenuate the volume by maybe 20 dB. Then I could enjoy the gig. My ears were still ringing after.

The TPS guys definitely have some hearing damage, but they aren't playing hours and hours at those volumes. They tend to play a few minutes, take a break to talk etc so it gives their ears some time to rest.

 

[James Freeman]

The amps are for show only, they are actually playing through a laptop with a Tom Hensan plugin for cleans and Rea Mastory for crunch.

 

[Eagle]

Funny you should mention that!

I saw Motörhead circa 1989 and I usually tell people that was the loudest gig I ever attended. Great gig; exciting. But unfortunately I probably was "in the beam". My ears were ringing for a week. I was at the front of the stage and their amp stacks were louder than the PA!

Suspect that did some damage.

Also met Lemmy in the bar afterwards... I was 19 years old. Too young, scared and nervous to say much and only managed a few words; but he was friendly and engaging. Nice fella.

Other loudest gig was the notoriously loud My Bloody Valentine, a year or two later at Reading University.

In the late 80s Lemmy was a regular in the bar at the Marquee.

 

[woody]

Sometimes I am watching that pedal show… and I am just really wondering .. how do these guys leave the room not with their ears ringing like crazy?

It almost hurts watching them or is that me being a wuss? I can take it if that’s the case. I don’t mean this literally, more like: damn .. 104 db constantly? Yikes. Marshall cranked? Yikes. In most situations it just stays around 99 to 104. It rarely is in the 80-90db range.

Case in example… super reverb vs deluxe reverb … they are testing how it sound cranked up. They get to level 7 … Dan is playing away maybe a meter away from those amps… the DB meter spiking at 103…
But even worse … Mick is IN FRONT OF THE AMPS tweaking away on those amps…

That would make me hurt even for 30 seconds?

I'm super sensitive to volume as well. My threshold of pain is much lower than other people's.
As soon as there's an acoustic drum set in the room I'm wearing ear plugs. I've got custom molded ear plugs. Best investment of my music life.
Most concerts I wear those plugs as well.

There's really nothing cool or manly about permanently damaging one's hearing, if you think about it.

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

I'm super sensitive to volume as well. My threshold of pain is much lower than other people's.
As soon as there's an acoustic drum set in the room I'm wearing ear plugs. I've got custom molded ear plugs. Best investment of my music life.
Most concerts I wear those plugs as well.

There's really nothing cool or manly about permanently damaging one's hearing, if you think about it.

Yeah, they must just accept that that will be their future. It’s their biggest passion, loud guitars. And it seems like they are willing to have serious hearing issues later in life.

I am not sure what would be worse, having (serious) hearing loss or tinnitus. I assume there latter.

 

[woody]

Yeah, they must just accept that that will be their future. It’s their biggest passion, loud guitars. And it seems like they are willing to have serious hearing issues later in life.

I am not sure what would be worse, having (serious) hearing loss or tinnitus. I assume there latter.

Perhaps they have already fried there ears a good deal.
Perhaps they are just less sensitive.

Don't get me wrong, loud guitars are great.
I really enjoy playing at levels that require hearing protection for me.
My personal threshold of pain is about 100db.
I find concerts at a sustained 95db uncomfortably loud.
I usually get away with 9db filters, which is subtle enough to let me have normal conversations with people in breaks.

I'm surely an outlier with my loudness sensitivity, but then at 43 I still can localize bats with my eyes closed on quiet evenings.
Ten years ago I always heard bats before I saw them.

 

[Jarick]

Sometimes I am watching that pedal show… and I am just really wondering .. how do these guys leave the room not with their ears ringing like crazy?

It almost hurts watching them or is that me being a wuss? I can take it if that’s the case. I don’t mean this literally, more like: damn .. 104 db constantly? Yikes. Marshall cranked? Yikes. In most situations it just stays around 99 to 104. It rarely is in the 80-90db range.

Case in example… super reverb vs deluxe reverb … they are testing how it sound cranked up. They get to level 7 … Dan is playing away maybe a meter away from those amps… the DB meter spiking at 103…
But even worse … Mick is IN FRONT OF THE AMPS tweaking away on those amps…

That would make me hurt even for 30 seconds?

I'm the exact same way. Anything over 80 dB I need earplugs. I could never do any of those demos at 100 dB without hearing protection.

I learned my lesson the hard way. I started playing drums at 11 years old and didn't wear earplugs. I started a rock band with my friends when I was 12 and we played without earplugs. We started to get louder amps and PA speakers and I started to develop tinnitus by the time I was 15. My ears started to crackle if there were loud noises, and I finally started wearing earplugs. But the damage was done and I've had to deal with worsening tinnitus over the last few years.

I've had a few tube amps over the last decade but have never turned them up past loud conversation level. Partly because there's no need playing at home by myself, partly because I have a wife and kids who would complain, and partly because I now hate/fear loud noise exposure. That's why I'm all in on modelers with headphones, studio monitors, and "FRFR" speakers.

I always bring earplugs now to shows because a couple years ago I got worse permanent hearing damage from people screaming around me at a concern (not even a good one, Brandy Carlile?). Sometimes I bring two pairs, I got a set of the Earasers which knock the volume down 5-10 dB and don't really impact the sound, and then a pair of the Hearos which are 12-20 dB.

I should add, I've had hearing tests done twice in the last few years, and I still have really good hearing, not much loss. One audiologist thought I probably used to have supersonic hearing which is common in musicians, and I lost some of that and now have regular hearing, but my brain fills in that void as tinnitus because it's used to the super hearing.

And tinnitus sucks but I've learned to deal with it and it's not that big of a deal unless I focus on it. It can be crippling for some people though and leads to serious mental health issues. It did for me for a while. But like any disability you can overcome it and still have a long and happy life.

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

Perhaps they have already fried there ears a good deal.
Perhaps they are just less sensitive.

Don't get me wrong, loud guitars are great.
I really enjoy playing at levels that require hearing protection for me.
My personal threshold of pain is about 100db.
I find concerts at a sustained 95db uncomfortably loud.
I usually get away with 9db filters, which is subtle enough to let me have normal conversations with people in breaks.

I'm surely an outlier with my loudness sensitivity, but then at 43 I still can localize bats with my eyes closed on quiet evenings.
Ten years ago I always heard bats before I saw them.

The Jazzmaster I have is from an older family member. He gave it to me because he just can’t hear any more. To many gigs in the 70s! But he did enjoy it all :)

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

I'm the exact same way. Anything over 80 dB I need earplugs. I could never do any of those demos at 100 dB without hearing protection.

I learned my lesson the hard way. I started playing drums at 11 years old and didn't wear earplugs. I started a rock band with my friends when I was 12 and we played without earplugs. We started to get louder amps and PA speakers and I started to develop tinnitus by the time I was 15. My ears started to crackle if there were loud noises, and I finally started wearing earplugs. But the damage was done and I've had to deal with worsening tinnitus over the last few years.

I've had a few tube amps over the last decade but have never turned them up past loud conversation level. Partly because there's no need playing at home by myself, partly because I have a wife and kids who would complain, and partly because I now hate/fear loud noise exposure. That's why I'm all in on modelers with headphones, studio monitors, and ""FRFR"" speakers.

Wow so young. That must be really rough, man.

I know ear protection can save your ears. But I do wonder if it’s worth the risk doing live performances if you don’t need to do it for work. a drummer easily hits 110 db , so even with hear protection bringing it down 20 db that would still be 90… isn’t that already in risky territory?

Then again … I 100% get the thrill being on stage.

 

[Jarick]

Wow so young. That must be really rough, man.

I know ear protection can save your ears. But I do wonder if it’s worth the risk doing live performances if you don’t need to do it for work. a drummer easily hits 110 db , so even with hear protection bringing it down 20 db that would still be 90… isn’t that already in risky territory?

Then again … I 100% get the thrill being on stage.

The loudest part of drums is the high frequencies and earplugs tend to block more at the high frequencies than lower frequencies. So if you look at the dB reduction, it's actually an average instead of peak. So 12 dB earplugs may take down the high frequencies by 20 dB, etc.

But there's different earplugs for different uses. I haven't played drums in a decade but if I were going to play them now I'd have some higher dB earplugs for that purpose.

 

[dk_ace]

When stages were louder, I just dealt with it but in hindsight the loud stages I played weren’t painfully loud. I never played loud like that in a small space except for goofing off in a music store or rehearsal or garage or something and that was never for a sustained period of time.

Listen to your ears, if you feel like something is too loud for you then get out of there and get some plugs. You unfortunately don’t get a do-over on hearing damage usually,

I had tinnitus issues develop at one point, moreso from gunfire than loud music although the music no doubt played a role. I started wearing earplugs to shows - the kind that supposedly dropped the volume with a flat response. That was a good call. Shows were more enjoyable after that and I honestly heard the bands better than I had in the past, wish I would have discovered those sooner. I don’t recall if I ever wore them on stage when it was loud. I’ve lost them now, need to get another pair. Stages are generally quiet enough or large enough now that I don’t need them.

The thing that bugs my ears onstage more than anything is the drums. Guitars are just as dangerous I guess, but they don’t have the harsh transient spikes like the drums so they sneak up on you.

D