Help me with choosing a delay!

[laxu]

I totally agree with your words.
I imagined that without a line mixer (which I would not want to use) I would not have been able to obtain the result.
As for the S/N - I doubt that the amp in question does not have a good S/N and I confirm that the S/N is serial.
Here is what the manual says: "Serial, full-tube effects loop recallable via footswitch."

Effects loops are not built equal, so I'd check if anyone has reported any issues with the fx loop levels.

The idea of buying a unit that is more multi-purpose (Delay and Rev) is not bad at all, given that my head does not have Reverb....

The Source Audio Collider is pretty lovely for that, though its reverbs are better than its delays. It's a reasonably good sweet spot for simplicity (not too many params per side) but the "switch sides to edit delay vs reverb" means the knobs almost never point at the right setting so you can't rely on any visual indicators for settings. I think it works best if you configure its presets, then just turn delay/reverb on/off as needed.

On the Strymon Volante or El Cap the reverb is mainly designed to go together with the delay to smooth it out. It sounds alright, but it's on the darker side. On the El Cap you can't adjust its decay time, on the Volante you can. I haven't tested on the El Cap, but on the Volante it's also easy to run it only as a reverb pedal by simply disabling all the delay lines.

 

[laxu]

I figured I'd need the line mixer to get the best result

Lots of delays have analog dry-through, so the way they work is something like this:

1. Guitar sound -> delay pedal.
2. Split signal to analog dry signal, and a copy converted to digital for processing.
3. Process the delay sound, then convert it back to analog.
4. Mix the converted analog delay signal back into the dry signal according to the mix knob ratio.
5. Delay pedal -> next device in signal chain.

So basically it is already kinda doing the job of the line mixer. But again pedals, fx loops etc are not built equal so how they work together is not always guaranteed. It's also entirely possible that you simply like how a delay sounds in front of an amp, even if it gets distorted if you run more gain from the amp.

 

[Mechanize]

Effects loops are not built equal, so I'd check if anyone has reported any issues with the fx loop levels.


The Source Audio Collider is pretty lovely for that, though its reverbs are better than its delays. It's a reasonably good sweet spot for simplicity (not too many params per side) but the "switch sides to edit delay vs reverb" means the knobs almost never point at the right setting so you can't rely on any visual indicators for settings. I think it works best if you configure its presets, then just turn delay/reverb on/off as needed.

On the Strymon Volante or El Cap the reverb is mainly designed to go together with the delay to smooth it out. It sounds alright, but it's on the darker side. On the El Cap you can't adjust its decay time, on the Volante you can. I haven't tested on the El Cap, but on the Volante it's also easy to run it only as a reverb pedal by simply disabling all the delay lines.

I confirm that, being Italian, I have a direct contact with Pierangelo Mezzabarba - the loop has no problem.
As for the choice of the pedal, my use of the Reverb is really minimal - just to give a bit of thing/ambience to my sounds.
I don't like the very effected sound, at all. But at the same time I like to experiment with the delay.
That said, I think the Volante at this point is the choice...

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

What single channel amps were you happily running the DM2 in front of, and how much gain are you using in the new amp compared to how dirty you were running those single channel amps? Does the DM2 work in front of the new amp well?

If the Skill 30 is too dirty for delay in front, but delay in the loop is too sterile - woof. You may need to use the line mixer with both a delay AND compressor, in series, in that order, in the loop to get what you are looking for.

 

[Mechanize]

Lots of delays have analog dry-through, so the way they work is something like this:

1. Guitar sound -> delay pedal.
2. Split signal to analog dry signal, and a copy converted to digital for processing.
3. Process the delay sound, then convert it back to analog.
4. Mix the converted analog delay signal back into the dry signal according to the mix knob ratio.
5. Delay pedal -> next device in signal chain.

So basically it is already kinda doing the job of the line mixer. But again pedals, fx loops etc are not built equal so how they work together is not always guaranteed. It's also entirely possible that you simply like how a delay sounds in front of an amp, even if it gets distorted if you run more gain from the amp.

Thank you so much for these great explanations you have provided me!
http://www.masottiamps.com/mxm_mixer.htm This is the mixer I own. T
he only reason I wanted to avoid was getting tangled up in cables... but if there is no solution...
Thanks again for your immense availability!

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

A tape delay with control over “record level” - Strymon El Capistrano and Volante; Catalinvred Belle Epoch; several others - is probably the best strategy for controlling the grittiness of a delay in a loop. You shouldn’t need a line mixer to make any of those work well.

 

[Mechanize]

What single channel amps were you happily running the DM2 in front of, and how much gain are you using in the new amp compared to how dirty you were running those single channel amps? Does the DM2 work in front of the new amp well?

If the Skill 30 is too dirty for delay in front, but delay in the loop is too sterile - woof. You may need to use the line mixer with both a delay AND compressor, in series, in that order, in the loop to get what you are looking for.

So far, having used single-channel amps and having built my sound all on the basis of a clean worthy of such note, I have never had any problems whatsoever - everything in line, one sound and off you go!
The problem arises because, as you yourself pointed out, it becomes impossible to use the delay in front with the Overdrive channel of the Skill - I can't give up that channel there! It's literally killer!

 

[laxu]

Thank you so much for these great explanations you have provided me!
http://www.masottiamps.com/mxm_mixer.htm This is the mixer I own. T
he only reason I wanted to avoid was getting tangled up in cables... but if there is no solution...
Thanks again for your immense availability!

Yeah I think that's useful only if you want to do things like run multiple delays, or delay+reverb in parallel without one affecting the other.

The SA Collider can run delay+reverb in parallel inside the box.

Give the Volante a try. Buy used and you should be able to sell it for what you paid if you don't end up liking it for any reason. It's still easily my favorite delay pedal.

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

So far, having used single-channel amps and having built my sound all on the basis of a clean worthy of such note, I have never had any problems whatsoever - everything in line, one sound and off you go!
The problem arises because, as you yourself pointed out, it becomes impossible to use the delay in front with the Overdrive channel of the Skill - I can't give up that channel there! It's literally killer!

Keep your DM2 in front of the amp for clean sounds; use a different delay in the loop for gain sounds.

 

[Mechanize]

Yeah I think that's useful only if you want to do things like run multiple delays, or delay+reverb in parallel without one affecting the other.

The SA Collider can run delay+reverb in parallel inside the box.

Give the Volante a try. Buy used and you should be able to sell it for what you paid if you don't end up liking it for any reason. It's still easily my favorite delay pedal.

Great and thanks again, really, much appreciated.
I think I'll do 3 tests:

1. Boss DM-2w with dummy jack in S/N with line mixer
2. Strymon Volante in S/N without line mixer
3. Strymon Volante in S/N with line mixer

As soon as I get a Volante I'll try to share the results with you all!

 

[Mechanize]

Keep your DM2 in front of the amp for clean sounds; use a different delay in the loop for gain sounds.

It could be a solution...

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

Personal favorite (does 100% wet)

 

[Mechanize]

Personal favorite (does 100% wet)

Yeah! That's a really nice pedal - I tried it a while back and it made a great impression on me.
I honestly didn't remember it having a 100% wet function (my needs were different back then).
Thanks so much for the tip!

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

Yeah! That's a really nice pedal - I tried it a while back and it made a great impression on me.
I honestly didn't remember it having a 100% wet function (my needs were different back then).
Thanks so much for the tip!

You can verify in the manual

 

[Mechanize]

You can verify in the manual

It's not necessary - you certainly know it better than me. I tried it a while ago, but then again, my needs were different and I remember returning it almost immediately

 

[Eagle]

Boss DD500 does everything you want still better than the vast majority.

 

[SonVolt]

Something structured that is more flexible and gives me more possibilities in terms of sounds and functions than a simple pedal and I repeat, that unlike the pedals, give me the option of Dry/Wet

Fractal VP4. Variety of delay blocks with KillDry functionality. Plus so much more...

 

[SonVolt]

The Fractal VP4 is a very good option, not just for delays, but reverbs too. If you wanted to have "kill dry" then you can just set whatever the first effect you choose to 100% mix, and enable the 'mute in' bypass mode on the effect block, which would effectively be the same thing.

VP4 has a Kill-Dry toggle for each of its 4 effect block.

 

[Mechanize]

VP4 has a Kill-Dry toggle for each of its 4 effect block.

Excellent quality but a bit too complex for me

 

[Mechanize]

Boss DD500 does everything you want still better than the vast majority.

I don't trust samples much, mostly YouTube ones. But I have to admit from what I've heard... It seems like a great pedal!