Fractal Talk

Netflix GIF
 
DrewJD82 said:
Funny, I had a marathon of ToneTalk playing in my living room when I got home from the dog park last night. I initially started warming up the Plexi50 but realized it's been months since I've written any of my own riffs/music and I was feeling something heavier than the Plexi50.

Grabbed my Solar, loaded up a 5153 in the AxeFX and like a riff dam broke open they were just spilling out. All the while I'm hearing Dave Friedman in the background state how modelers don't give you any inspiration and every other stereotypical trope that's been mindlessly stated for the last 20 years. The kicker, though, was getting through 4-5 episodes of that and then the more recent episode comes up where someone asks them if they'd ever have a modeling company on and Dave says "Cliff from Fractal would be pretty cool, actually".....as if he hadn't devoted several minutes of nearly every episode trash talking Cliff's work. :rofl

When that particular episode first aired I was watching it live (actually asked Dave a question in it) and shot Cliff a message letting him know there was interest in having him on. At the time I hadn't just heard 5 episodes of modeler trash talking that has most certainly created a reluctance to be on the show. That said, I do think it'd be a GREAT episode and I'd LOVE to hear Cliff get into the details with someone like Dave. Not because I see them as equals in related fields, but I don't believe it'd give Dave a chance to take a swipe at modeling while being informed how deep the insight goes into making those models.

I'd also volunteer to bring my rig over to Mark Huzansky's place for the episode as he's about 20 minutes from me so as the conversation went along I can show him in real time what's being spoken about. I'd even promise to refrain from randomly shouting at various intervals "ROLL THE VOLUME KNOB DOWN! SEE?! JUST LIKE AN AMP, ISN'T IT?! ADMIT IT!!!" since that seems to be a recurring diss towards modeling.
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Cool post! I'd tune in.

And while you are at it please try to get Marc to re-record that trash-tastic riff that opens the show
and sounds like it was recorded on an ADAT in 1989. :hmm
 
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GTR37 said:
That would be an amazing episode IMO and Dave might actually learn something about the modelling how much goes into and how much detail is in the models
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I’m not sure Dave would learn anything new about how Cliff models things. Dave if anything, isn’t stupid. Opinionated? Absolutely. I doubt though he would change his mind not because he has some tube amp builder, shit on everything non tube, alterior motives but becuase just knowing how something is done (which Dave knows a lot about amps) doesn’t change what people prefer with amps over modelers. Could be wrong but I doubt it. People just have different experiences than others playing, recording, mixing live etc some types of gear. Why that’s an issue I’m not sure.
 
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Question on ‘Speaker Impedance Curve’ setting in the Advanced menu of the amp block.

Should it be an impedance that best matches the amp in sort of a traditional pairing sense?

Or should you pick an impedance curve that matches the actual physical cab you’re playing through?

IMG_7015.jpeg


IMG_7013.jpeg
 
LCW said:
Question on ‘Speaker Impedance Curve’ setting in the Advanced menu of the amp block.

Should it be an impedance that best matches the amp in sort of a traditional pairing sense?

Or should you pick an impedance curve that matches the actual physical cab you’re playing through?

View attachment 48078

View attachment 48079
Click to expand...

Ideally, you would use the impedance curve of your exact cabinet when playing with a solid state amp and a real guitar cab. I have measured the impedance curves of my cabs and have attempted to match that by adjusting the parameters in the speaker tab of the amp block. The most important thing is that the low frequency resonance is close to that of your actual cabinet.

Ultimately, it all comes down to what sounds and feels best, so use your best judgement.
 
DrewJD82 said:
Funny, I had a marathon of ToneTalk playing in my living room when I got home from the dog park last night. I initially started warming up the Plexi50 but realized it's been months since I've written any of my own riffs/music and I was feeling something heavier than the Plexi50.

Grabbed my Solar, loaded up a 5153 in the AxeFX and like a riff dam broke open they were just spilling out. All the while I'm hearing Dave Friedman in the background state how modelers don't give you any inspiration and every other stereotypical trope that's been mindlessly stated for the last 20 years. The kicker, though, was getting through 4-5 episodes of that and then the more recent episode comes up where someone asks them if they'd ever have a modeling company on and Dave says "Cliff from Fractal would be pretty cool, actually".....as if he hadn't devoted several minutes of nearly every episode trash talking Cliff's work. :rofl

When that particular episode first aired I was watching it live (actually asked Dave a question in it) and shot Cliff a message letting him know there was interest in having him on. At the time I hadn't just heard 5 episodes of modeler trash talking that has most certainly created a reluctance to be on the show. That said, I do think it'd be a GREAT episode and I'd LOVE to hear Cliff get into the details with someone like Dave. Not because I see them as equals in related fields, but I don't believe it'd give Dave a chance to take a swipe at modeling while being informed how deep the insight goes into making those models.

I'd also volunteer to bring my rig over to Mark Huzansky's place for the episode as he's about 20 minutes from me so as the conversation went along I can show him in real time what's being spoken about. I'd even promise to refrain from randomly shouting at various intervals "ROLL THE VOLUME KNOB DOWN! SEE?! JUST LIKE AN AMP, ISN'T IT?! ADMIT IT!!!" since that seems to be a recurring diss towards modeling.
Click to expand...
They had nothing bit praise for the recent EVH pack that came out on Tonex and said multiple times how good it sounded. I dont think Dave hates modelling so much as he thinks it’s much more fiddly than just turning on an amp and making a few changes, which is a valid opinion that many share, that’s the whole premise of his X pedal line (which has power amp modelling).
 
LCW said:
Question on ‘Speaker Impedance Curve’ setting in the Advanced menu of the amp block.

Should it be an impedance that best matches the amp in sort of a traditional pairing sense?

Or should you pick an impedance curve that matches the actual physical cab you’re playing through?

View attachment 48078

View attachment 48079
Click to expand...
If you are going for accuracy, then an impedance curve that matches the impedance of your physical cab.

Otherwise, just use it as another tone shaping tool.
 
dws2384 said:
They had nothing bit praise for the recent EVH pack that came out on Tonex and said multiple times how good it sounded. I dont think Dave hates modelling so much as he thinks it’s much more fiddly than just turning on an amp and making a few changes, which is a valid opinion that many share, that’s the whole premise of his X pedal line (which has power amp modelling).
Click to expand...

That was definitely the absolute most credit he's ever given a digital amp sim and also a reason why I think if Dave learned more about the extent of effort that's gone into modeling he'd have more appreciation for it. If IK released that pack without Jim attached to it, it'd never have been on ToneTalk, but because Dave's already aware of Jim's work and the effort he's gone through to get EVH tones and the fact he's willing to attach his name to it gives it some legitimacy for him. Similarly to Dave talking about the ToneX cab in a positive light based off Pete Thorn's comments on it.

I've been a 'fan' of Dave since the late 90's when Guitar Shop covered Vai's 96' rig that Dave built. When he first popped up on HRI he was like a celebrity to me because that Vai rig really pushed me into gear nerdery and I've been utilizing and appreciating his insight since that time, '04-ish. I will own a JEL at somepoint in the near future. Me picking at his distaste for modeling isn't because I'm a hardcore modeling fan or think Dave is an idiot, it's because I'm quite aware of his knowledge, experience and his overall personality, I haven't missed an episode of ToneTalk once and it's something I regularly put on for background noise, I've heard quite a few of those episodes multiple times. So with all that in mind; I don't find his comments/opinion on modeling to be aligned with everything I've come to know about him in 21 years of him regularly being in my orbit.

Without hyperbole, it's in 90% of ToneTalk episodes and I'd say I were only pushing it if I claimed it was in 97%-100% of them. We're in a couple of the same guitar FB groups and it's no different there. He'll bring it up when no one else does, he'll have guests on who are speaking positively of modeling until him and Marc tagteam shittalk it until the guests pivots to caveats and concessions, he says shit like "roll the volume knob down on a modeler and nothing happens", "you can't get inspired with a modeler" (that one turned into a discussion of the quality of music being subpar due to being written with a modeler and not a loud amp, it wasn't a personal proclaimation). He's far more intelligent than that and it comes off as petty and defensive as a result.
 
DrewJD82 said:
That was definitely the absolute most credit he's ever given a digital amp sim and also a reason why I think if Dave learned more about the extent of effort that's gone into modeling he'd have more appreciation for it. If IK released that pack without Jim attached to it, it'd never have been on ToneTalk, but because Dave's already aware of Jim's work and the effort he's gone through to get EVH tones and the fact he's willing to attach his name to it gives it some legitimacy for him. Similarly to Dave talking about the ToneX cab in a positive light based off Pete Thorn's comments on it.

I've been a 'fan' of Dave since the late 90's when Guitar Shop covered Vai's 96' rig that Dave built. When he first popped up on HRI he was like a celebrity to me because that Vai rig really pushed me into gear nerdery and I've been utilizing and appreciating his insight since that time, '04-ish. I will own a JEL at somepoint in the near future. Me picking at his distaste for modeling isn't because I'm a hardcore modeling fan or think Dave is an idiot, it's because I'm quite aware of his knowledge, experience and his overall personality, I haven't missed an episode of ToneTalk once and it's something I regularly put on for background noise, I've heard quite a few of those episodes multiple times. So with all that in mind; I don't find his comments/opinion on modeling to be aligned with everything I've come to know about him in 21 years of him regularly being in my orbit.

Without hyperbole, it's in 90% of ToneTalk episodes and I'd say I were only pushing it if I claimed it was in 97%-100% of them. We're in a couple of the same guitar FB groups and it's no different there. He'll bring it up when no one else does, he'll have guests on who are speaking positively of modeling until him and Marc tagteam shittalk it until the guests pivots to caveats and concessions, he says shit like "roll the volume knob down on a modeler and nothing happens", "you can't get inspired with a modeler" (that one turned into a discussion of the quality of music being subpar due to being written with a modeler and not a loud amp, it wasn't a personal proclaimation). He's far more intelligent than that and it comes off as petty and defensive as a result.
Click to expand...

Cool post. Fair and balanced. Unlike Dave's understanding of "modeling" and his consistent rants about it. :LOL:

He's just so repetitive and kind of wearing thin with me. :idk

"Silent stages are killing live music..... blah blah blah..... "

"Live music is not what it used to be because ...... blah blah blah..... "

"Digital gets lost in the mix.... blah blah blah...."

"Digital has no dynamics...... yadda yadda yadda..... "

I actually agree with him on so much. I just find it old, worn-out, tired, and not worth repeating EVERY episode. :facepalm


:brick


Then again ... maybe we each have our own Greatest Hits Rants that we put on repeat and don't know it. :LOL:
 
Out of genuine curiosity why do some of you guys think if Dave doesn’t know it already (I doubt this) but say it’s true that if he learned more effort than he’s aware of is put into modeling… that would be where he would start liking modeling?
 
ejecta said:
Out of genuine curiosity why do some of you guys think if Dave doesn’t know it already (I doubt this) but say it’s true that if he learned more effort than he’s aware of is put into modeling… that would be where he would start liking modeling?
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I don't know if it's so much about "liking" modeling vs making it seem so bad. Maybe just having a mutual respect for it?

At the end of the day, guy sells amps. It's in his best interest to not promote digital.
 
Mongillo19 said:
I don't know if it's so much about "liking" modeling vs making it seem so bad. Maybe just having a mutual respect for it?

At the end of the day, guy sells amps. It's in his best interest to not promote digital.
Click to expand...
See I don’t see him “hating” modeling or thinks it’s “bad.” He definitely prefers amps. Form what I’ve gathered from his online presence all the way when I started being aware of him back on Rig Talk is that to me and what I hear he doesn’t buy into the idea that playing a modeler is the same as playing a tube amps rig like some claim. I don’t see that as hate. I see that as an opinion that to has validity. In fact he says that modelers do serve a great purpose for the right situation.

Look I’m no Dave fanboy. I don’t like any of his amps. I like only a couple of his pedals. You couldn’t give me one his amps. It makes me think his beloved 50 watt he bases his “sound” isn’t what I think a good Marshall sounds like. His mileage obviously varies. He would greatly disagree with me. I wouldn’t take any of that as hate.

Which is it’s just his ears and opinion. Again what about his opinion of modelers such a big deal?

The thing that irritates me the most about him and his personality is his more than noticeable name dropping in an interview with others who have nothing to with who he’s dropping and at times he over talks the guests bad. That to me is the most irritating about his show.
 
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