JiveTurkey
Goatlord
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Looks like it's retained it's existing place on the TGF Official Receptiveness List 
Fender TMP Firmware v1.7 Released
- Thread starter ChordInversion
- Start date
synthpenguin
Roadie
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- 646
It is odd that they don't have more classic Fender models on this already, but at the same time they seem to be wanting to add a lot of varied sound options. It's no secret that there is extreme overlap between a lot of the Fender amps, especially in the context of a modeler where output volume and speaker configuration differences are moot.
I love the idea of the TMP as a museum of Fender amps and history, but I also don't know how I'd feel if I was an owner and each amp update brought a bunch of minor variations of the same few circuits. Ideally, the update schedule would be faster, and/or there would have been more amps at launch, and there'd be both, but I don't think any other company is able to keep up with the Line 6 or Fractal rate of updates (at least without captures).
The FX in this update seem really cool.
And it's great to see this style of "synth" effect on modelers. I don't think any of the others offer this approach? Which is weird because I feel like a lot of them could do it, but yeah.
I love the idea of the TMP as a museum of Fender amps and history, but I also don't know how I'd feel if I was an owner and each amp update brought a bunch of minor variations of the same few circuits. Ideally, the update schedule would be faster, and/or there would have been more amps at launch, and there'd be both, but I don't think any other company is able to keep up with the Line 6 or Fractal rate of updates (at least without captures).
The FX in this update seem really cool.
And it's great to see this style of "synth" effect on modelers. I don't think any of the others offer this approach? Which is weird because I feel like a lot of them could do it, but yeah.
Jarick
Rock Star
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From an amp standpoint there's three tweeds, four blackface, one brownface, three blonde, and then five modern Fender amps. To me the only real omissions for classic amps are a tweed Champ and a blackface Bassman.
Actually I think it would be neat to see more unique Fenders, like the 68 Custom models or the 2000's Supersonic. That would be a lot more interesting than having yet another blackface amp that has essentially the same layout with a different transformer or power tubes.
I still see a gap in the chimey EL84 space, specifically a Matchless DC-30 or Morgan AC20. Hell I'm weird enough that I think it'd be fun to have a DSL100 or Valvestate but not even Fractal has those.
Anyways my wish list was a lot more on the effects side, I wanted them to fix the Micropitch, more cool rack delays, allow us to defeat the dry signal degradation on some of the vintage effects, and the amps I mentioned above. They got about half of that and added a bunch of other neat stuff and fixed some QOL issues.
Actually I think it would be neat to see more unique Fenders, like the 68 Custom models or the 2000's Supersonic. That would be a lot more interesting than having yet another blackface amp that has essentially the same layout with a different transformer or power tubes.
I still see a gap in the chimey EL84 space, specifically a Matchless DC-30 or Morgan AC20. Hell I'm weird enough that I think it'd be fun to have a DSL100 or Valvestate but not even Fractal has those.
Anyways my wish list was a lot more on the effects side, I wanted them to fix the Micropitch, more cool rack delays, allow us to defeat the dry signal degradation on some of the vintage effects, and the amps I mentioned above. They got about half of that and added a bunch of other neat stuff and fixed some QOL issues.
ChordInversion
Roadie
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It would be weird indeed, but...I'd bet the 2000s model is the one. Again, I'd be stunned if they didn't put a year on a vintage model, as they do with all the others.
ChordInversion
Roadie
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- 604
That's not true at all. Not even close to true. Think of the Vibrolux (and Reverb), Tremolux, Tweed Twin, Champ, Pro, Bandmaster. The more modern Dual Professional. They made a lot of cool amps that aren't all the same scooped blackface or tweed Bassman. The only brown panel is a Princeton? Really? And the blonde DR and TR are not blonde. At all. That's just a name they use for their Tone Master amps with different speakers and a bright cap mod.
I would love for them to include the Super-Sonics, with all their channels. That would be super cool.
And speakers. And hey, if they're so close, it should be easy for them to swap cabinets and roll those models out, Moreover, there's a lot of Fenders out there that aren't mid 60s black panels. It's weird to me that people don't know that.
100%.
You're going to get what you want. They're clearly focusing more on effects, while throwing in a bass amp and a high gain and a not-actually-new (the blonde Tone Master Twin in this update was already doable if you just changed cabinets on the old Twin) amp here or there.
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synthpenguin
Roadie
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Maybe someone who is part of the Discord can ask.
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I'll bet it does a mean Punched Lasagna.
ChordInversion
Roadie
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Asked and answered: From Mr. Stilwel
"The model is based on the 2009 version, which was an homage to the original 1952. The 2009 model had a tube preamp paired with a Class D power amp rather than a full tube amp. It was around for about 8-9 years and then discontinued, but it's kind of gained a cult-following since then."
Frodebro
Rock Star
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- 3,438
Just my opinion here, but if I was planning the roadmap for the TMP I would have made sure that it had a solid representation of iconic Fender amps at launch, along with the usual list of most popular other amps. They knocked it out of the park on the UI and convolution reverbs, but missed the boat on some really important things that would have ranked it much better against Helix and the FM9. I can only imagine what the emails and memos were like between the developers, the sales team, and management leading up to launch. The sales team were really left hanging to try and deal with the insanity.
![[Nathan]](/data/avatars/m/0/613.jpg?1726885163){kind=avatar}
[Nathan]
Shredder
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- 1,066
I’ll firmly stand on the hill that if they had added in capturing there’d be more interest in the ecosystem which would lead to more sales which would lead to more dev no doubt, but they didn’t do it. Wouldn’t really be a big addition now that everything has capturing but it would have been great in the last 1-2 years since it launched. I guess if they had a new spin on capturing or had a NAM block they might be a compelling reason. But another bog standard QC style capturing, eh, nice to have but not game changing imo. The only reason I’d say a NAM block is a big benefit is backwards compatibility with that entire ecosystem. You’re not relying on people to start capturing from scratch, you have access to all the stuff you wanna use already, but with the hardware and ease of use of the TMP.What's really funny to me is that the participation on the TMP Discord is so sparse. You grow to recognize the handful of people who do almost all of the posting very quickly. In theory there are 195 members online right now, but they're all clearly in other Discords. The talk they get elsewhere online (including here) tells a similar story. Their YouTube channel views and comments are also really low for a lot of videos.
No wonder the dev team prioritized the obscure bass amp request from an accomplished-but-not-household-name bassist.
I’m a beta tester these days for them. Not sure if the full firmware update was listed here but it’s actually quite expansive if you take a look. Tons of product enhancements and fixes ontop of the new amps/fx that were added. I think this has been one of the biggest updates I can recall so well done in the grand scheme.
Of course I just gravitate to the amps and fx and there’s not much moving the needle there for me. I can only assume the other stuff took precedent for whatever reason. I can’t really get upset about the trajectory because the course has been consistent since day1, it is what it is. I’d love to see more high gain amps and capturing but who knows if/when that’s coming.
[Nathan]
Shredder
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- 1,066
Full firmware relase:
ChordInversion
Roadie
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- 604
I understand your thoughts on this, and they are not baseless. I don't know that I agree, particularly since the skeuomorphic interface would be effectively inert for all of those NAM captures, but I'm also not going to declare you to be wrong. If anything, capture would make me a bit less interested, for reasons I've beaten to death. It made me less interested in the Stadium, too, though I ordered one anyway and took solace from @Digital Igloo sharing that he was reluctant about Proxy himself.
Oh, I read through all of it.
I feel the same. I'm not going to use much of that stuff at all. I'm not their target demo. That's fine.
Oh *I* can, specifically because it hasn't changed, but also hasn't really been elucidated. People on the Discord have been filling up the amp request channel, and apparently almost entirely in vain, for a long time now. They should just say it's going to be one high gain amp, one bass amp, one "kinda cheating" amp (the second Blues Junior and the "blonde" Twin in this one are just a cab - and for the Twin, a bright cap mod), and one non high gain amp people asked for. Then we can decide how patient we are. But they do not. So it goes.
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[Nathan]
Shredder
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Haha, gold, accurate / 10
ChordInversion
Roadie
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- 604
I'll also add that the "all things in time" line, repeated by their team lead many times, gets kind of infuriating after a while. Oh, goody, when I'm in my 70s, they'll stop playing catch up on things like scenes, stop fixating on MIDI and synths and adding more delays, and then maybe we'll get two whole non-metal, non-bass amps every six months. One or two might actually be a real Fender model, not one made up for the Tone Master line. Maybe some time in the 2030s, they'll even finish the Vibro-King, bringing it to parity with the DR in terms of on-amp controls! Oh boy! Dare I imagine multiple inputs and channels for amps that have them? No, that asks too much.
I wish they would just level with us and admit that they, Fender, are not into the old Fender amps (or EL84 amps, or other Mesas, and so on). Hell, I'm not even a guy who insists everything must have a Dumble and/or a Trainwreck, but I'd take that over some of this WTAF stuff taking up effort in a sparse amp range. But no. They might have another accomplished-but-not-household-name bassist asking for another bass amp with a Class D solid state power amp "that's kind of gained a cult-following," after all. Now that is exciting.
I get it. I sound petty and a little over the top. I had high hopes for this particular piece of gear, and I'm feeling dumb about that. I will give them credit for finally carving out something functionally distinctive with the synth stuff...but I don't use synth stuff much at all. So it remains a practice device for me. If selling wasn't such a pain these days, I'd probably dump mine. Because "in time" is a perfectly and completely meaningless statement.
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If we’ve learned anything with new companies getting in to modelers it’s that it takes a long time for them to hit feature and tone parity with established competition. What else can Fender say, other than “we’re working on it”? The only question really is, do you believe them? Judging by the updates they keep releasing, I think it’s fair to say Fender seem completely committed to developing the TMP.
If they ask 100 people what they want, they’ll get a hundred different answers. So there is never going to be a magical update that addresses anyone’s specific list of wants and wishes.
Which is why you pretty much have to take these devices for what they are, because banking on any one future update to be a cure all, in the short-term, is sure to disappoint.
Agree pretty much although I will side with @ChordInversion on one point in particular:
Clearly, Fender is trying their best to present a balanced selection of amps in each update drawing from modern, classic non-Fender and Fender categories in near equal measure. It basically seems that the past few updates have a quota of at least "a couple of Fenders".
The selection of WHICH Fenders, however, does beg some scrutiny. Little too much Blues Jr./bright cap or mod variants of what's already in there, if you will. And with the bass amp firmware update excepted, it's been that way for going on 18 months now.
They are clearly committed, and that's a great thing from a company's first swing at the big leagues. I just really hope this next update is a definitive showing of them taking in this feedback about the Fender amp selection. They've covered most of the other basses.
ChordInversion
Roadie
- Messages
- 604
I think it's reasonable to ask for a sense of priorities. Some may disagree. But also, there are lots of things they clearly are not going to do, but they've never once said anything other than "all things in time." I do believe that they are working to enhance the product and add features. I don't believe that they care all that much about amp selection, and yes, that surprises me. I'd like for them to be transparent about that. The 'call it a new amp' for a bright cap mod/speaker swap for a TR/DR, or a second speaker cabinet for a Blues Junior, tell me that story.
Never expected that, but glad to have that out there so we can agree.
That's why I feel silly. I just figured that two years later, they would have more interest in their own amps than they do.
ChordInversion
Roadie
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- 604
I wonder if they have a mandate not to put much from Fender into the TMP that isn't also being sold as a current model or reissue right now - with some emphasis on physical Tone Master amps. There are 14 "different" (some are just minor changes that could be settings) Fender combo guitar amps in the TMP right now. Of those, 8 are either current Tone Master amps or (in the case of the Bassman Custom) a closely related 'modded' one. Three more are budget amps. One of the remaining three (the Vibro-King) has been left unfinished for a long time now.
A cross-development model with the physical line would partially explain the glacial pace.
EDIT: Either that, or they just plain don't care about Fender amps.
A cross-development model with the physical line would partially explain the glacial pace.
EDIT: Either that, or they just plain don't care about Fender amps.
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I think the lesson from the TMP is: if you don't have parity on the day of your initial release, you'll probably never catch up. You can have updates to improve, but so does everybody else, which makes the parity goal forever out of reach.