E-drums: could they be a common thing for small bands gigs?

[Ozamataz]

Seemed to work fine for Bill Bruford.

 

[KingsXJJ]

Not you @DrewJD82. The other ones.

 

[OneEng]

One more anecdote from personal experience:

I recently played a choir concert with a small orchestra. The first rehearsal the drums were too loud in the very echo-y old cathedral where the concert was going to be held, so at the second rehearsal the drummer brought in e-drums to control volume.

The e-drums sounded so unnatural in the house mix with all of the real orchestral instruments and voices that everyone hated it. Even the FOH sound tech hated it. The e-drums just weren’t capable of blending correctly with everything else.

It sounded like when you have a meeting and everyone is there in the room, but there’s that one guy who is remote and so you’re hearing his voice through laptop speakers

So the decision was to go back to real drums for the concerts. The drummer pulled back on his dynamics and everything sounded so much better.

@OneEng to your point about the importance of vocals in the mix, I play for choir concerts a few times a year and in that setting the vocals are all that really matters. It’s a vocal concert and the instrumentalists are strictly there to accompany them, so the vocals mix in FOH is the highest priority. Almost every one of these shows I’ve done has used real drums. If the drums were causing any problems with vocal mix in the house nobody would allow it. The choir director runs the show and all they care about is the vocals in the mix. They would never allow an instrument to be too loud in the mix. Yet somehow the real drums work on this setting.

You can’t expect me to believe that real drums work well in that setting where the FOH vocal mix is all anyone cares about, but they can’t work in a cover band

In most choir concerts, there is ample room to get the drums a good distance from the vocal mics though. Still, I'm sure it sounded great.

The sound man is good, he he's the man that always do the sound for the other band we where sharing the stage with.
PA is just basic stuff, 2 Fbt subs and 4 Fbt speakers

View attachment 49932

Yes the drums are Alesis, strike model I believe.

They are a little bit old and long in the tooth, but the FBT speakers (those look like the MAXX 6A's) were pretty good stuff .... especially for a plastic cab box. I'll bet it sounded pretty good out front (shoot, it sounded pretty good on a phone camera .... and how often does that happen?).

I thought the drums sounded just fine. Nothing reached out and grabbed me as being artificial or bad sounding at all.

 

[OneEng]

Most importantly, the mix was pretty good (I did think the cymbals were too high in the mix ... but it is a minor quibble easily disputed by another persons taste IMO).

 

[metropolis_4]

In most choir concerts, there is ample room to get the drums a good distance from the vocal mics though. Still, I'm sure it sounded great.

Actually, what I typically see is the opposite. Because there are so many people on the stage between all the choir members and the orchestra, there is much less space and the orchestra tends to be very close to the singers. Often the drums are no more than a few feet away from the singers

Also the mics being used for the choir aren’t set up to capture a single isolated voice from a couple inches away, they are capturing the whole choir from a further distance

 

[HotRats]

I agree. Great performance, but the drums don’t sound that great, particularly the cymbals.

Let's be honest, performance isn't great either. But that's off topic, fortunately.

 

[HotRats]

They are a little bit old and long in the tooth, but the FBT speakers (those look like the MAXX 6A's) were pretty good stuff .... especially for a plastic cab box. I'll bet it sounded pretty good out front (shoot, it sounded pretty good on a phone camera .... and how often does that happen?).

I find them a bit harsh when pushed hard but other than that they are not bad at all.
Workhorse stuff for sure.

I thought the drums sounded just fine. Nothing reached out and grabbed me as being artificial or bad sounding at all.

Believe me that cymbals sounded like shit and overall the kit felt sterile on stage.

Most importantly, the mix was pretty good (I did think the cymbals were too high in the mix ... but it is a minor quibble easily disputed by another persons taste IMO).

My cymbals being too loud comment was about what I've heard when the other band was playing. They used several different kits and, as fast as I know, never the one our drummer used.

 

[OneEng]

Let's be honest, performance isn't great either. But that's off topic, fortunately.

It was only a small clip, but it sounded pretty decent.

Believe me that cymbals sounded like shit and overall the kit felt sterile on stage.

There shouldn't be any sound at all from those cymbals on stage . How did it sound bad? Were there wedges?

My cymbals being too loud comment was about what I've heard when the other band was playing. They used several different kits and, as fast as I know, never the one our drummer used.

The drums have individual outputs. Were they using them .... or just the stereo out? If the former, the person at the board could have toned the cymbals down in the mix.

 

[HotRats]

There shouldn't be any sound at all from those cymbals on stage . How did it sound bad? Were there wedges?

Of course there was a monitoring system. Floor wedges for everyone + the drummer has 2 Bose (or bose like) towers for personal monitoring of the e-drums only.

But when I say they sounded like shit I mean they sound clearly fake.

The drums have individual outputs. Were they using them .... or just the stereo out? If the former, the person at the board could have toned the cymbals down in the mix.

No, stereo out only. don't ask me why.
Using the stereo out only is absurd.

 

[OneEng]

Of course there was a monitoring system. Floor wedges for everyone + the drummer has 2 Bose (or bose like) towers for personal monitoring of the e-drums only.

But when I say they sounded like shit I mean they sound clearly fake.

For venues where several bands share the stage and there has to be quick turn around, with the exception of the headliner, floor wedges are the best solution.

I haven't had a stage sharing gig for around 5 years now. I would definitely miss our IEM system.

"Clearly fake" can still contribute to a really nice FOH sound though. Of course, YMMV.

No, stereo out only. don't ask me why.
Using the stereo out only is absurd.

My first eKit drummer had TD10's (which were considered pretty good vDrums at that time) and was using only the stereo out when I first met him. I was able to convince him to let the FOH engineer mix the drums. For some reason, lots of eDrummers seem to think they know what sounds good better than the person behind the mixer (who can actually hear the entire band like the audience is hearing them).

I agree, using the stereo out is absurd.

 

[sashimi]

 

[GuitarBilly74]

I thought the drums sounded just fine. Nothing reached out and grabbed me as being artificial or bad sounding at all.

You did not notice anything artificial in the drum sounds of that video??? For real???

Good lord. Please post a list of all the venues you work at in the US so I can actively avoid them.

 

[HotRats]

"Clearly fake" can still contribute to a really nice FOH sound though. Of course, YMMV.

Oh well, a band using shitty and fake sounds, sounds bad even with a technically good FOH mix.

I value the core sounds more than the foh mix for sure, and the equation "acoustic drums = bad foh mix" is clearly false, so there also that....

I don't know man, might be that you're so used to play with e-drums that you don't remember how good an acoustic kit really is, in comparison.

 

[HotRats]

Another snippet from last gig with the Alesis kit