What's preventing you from getting a Helix Stadium (if you really want to buy it eventually)?

[Jarick]

I’m not gonna loss any sleep over a bunch of people think the Stadium isn’t there yet for them to jump in. Honestly, what’s the rush?

But quite a few are saying the tones aren’t improved or even that different from Helix, and often leave out they haven’t actually used the thing at all. Again, who cares what other people think, but you’d get the same reaction if I commented “QC doesn’t sound better than POD HD” or ”Axe FX III doesn’t sound different than II so just get the II” without having tried the devices in question.

For some reason the vitriol against Line 6 is a bit worse than usual and I’m not sure why? And the whole ad things could be said for other modelers too, that’s why I suggest people try things out and return if they’re not feeling it.

Well I wouldn't call disliking or not wanting to buy something "vitriol"...I don't see tons of negativity around Stadium or Line 6. It's more like mild enthusiasm, indifference, or mild disappointment.

I haven't used the Stadium so I can't speak to how it sounds or feels. I do know that they only have a small number of amps with the new modeling and I do know the effects are the same as before. Maybe there's a tiny bit of sonic improvement from better converters or something but I've never heard converters wow me before. To me that's not a compelling reason to spend $2k+ on a new modeler.

Then again I'm much closer to feeling like I want to sell off almost all my gear compared to wanting to buy more stuff. So I may be just the wrong target at this time.

 

[dbfretz]

Well I wouldn't call disliking or not wanting to buy something "vitriol"...I don't see tons of negativity around Stadium or Line 6. It's more like mild enthusiasm, indifference, or mild disappointment.

I haven't used the Stadium so I can't speak to how it sounds or feels. I do know that they only have a small number of amps with the new modeling and I do know the effects are the same as before. Maybe there's a tiny bit of sonic improvement from better converters or something but I've never heard converters wow me before. To me that's not a compelling reason to spend $2k+ on a new modeler.

Then again I'm much closer to feeling like I want to sell off almost all my gear compared to wanting to buy more stuff. So I may be just the wrong target at this time.

Completely agree. The fact is they’ve released a new modeller that at it’s very best sounds at least as good as competition that’s been out for years, and even then that’s debatable for certain sounds. The effects haven’t been updated at all and for a new flagship device it just feels really half baked. That’s a fair view.

 

[GTR37]

It went bye-bye a ways back

Well I wouldn't call disliking or not wanting to buy something "vitriol"...I don't see tons of negativity around Stadium or Line 6. It's more like mild enthusiasm, indifference, or mild disappointment.

I haven't used the Stadium so I can't speak to how it sounds or feels. I do know that they only have a small number of amps with the new modeling and I do know the effects are the same as before. Maybe there's a tiny bit of sonic improvement from better converters or something but I've never heard converters wow me before. To me that's not a compelling reason to spend $2k+ on a new modeler.

Then again I'm much closer to feeling like I want to sell off almost all my gear compared to wanting to buy more stuff. So I may be just the wrong target at this time.

Yeah I have found overall it been a pretty quiet launch
I am sure they are selling a ton of them as they are sold out most places
But I am not seeing artists or anyone really raving about them
I agree w you it’s been a Lukewarm reception on many channels

Fractal w AM4 and now Icons
As Well as QC mini has probably also not helped the cause IMO

 

[JiveTurkey]

Catching up on this thread just about anyone who has answered the OP gets basically called a bot. People are so sensitive they can’t handle a challenging opinion…

I have barely seen anyone using the Stadium in videos who doesn’t have some financial incentive to promote it. I’m pretty over watching thinly veiled ads.

I thought the OP was a bot at one point

 

[Jarick]

Yeah I have found overall it been a pretty quiet launch
I am sure they are selling a ton of them as they are sold out most places
But I am not seeing artists or anyone really raving about them
I agree w you it’s been a Lukewarm reception on many channels

Fractal w AM4 and now Icons
As Well as QC mini has probably also not helped the cause IMO

Honestly price may be a much bigger factor than we realize.

Not saying Stadium is overpriced but a $2k modeler may be a much harder sell than a $1k modeler. Curious how the Floor does here.

 

[JiveTurkey]

At least I didn´t insult anyone. That´s taking it personal and, don´t fool yourself, it´s not the way to go for friendly sharing opinions. In fact, it´s just the opposite.

You´re the one who needs to calm down and have a siesta.

Only the "Fractal People" insult others. Don't you know this?!?!?

 

[mikah912]

Yeah I have found overall it been a pretty quiet launch
I am sure they are selling a ton of them as they are sold out most places
But I am not seeing artists or anyone really raving about them
I agree w you it’s been a Lukewarm reception on many channels

Fractal w AM4 and now Icons
As Well as QC mini has probably also not helped the cause IMO

To be fair, what non-affiliated "artists" are "really raving" about QC Mini or AM4?

I took a look at the YT presence for the AM4, and the vast majority of vids were from a month ago. Aside from Leon Todd, most of the recent content is from people selling presets for it.

That's just the way of the GearTuber-sphere now. I'm already seeing "Why I'm selling my QC Mini!" vids too. It's one big repeating cycle of uninspired meh.

I would actually agree that there seems to be more vinegar than usual for Line 6 and this product, but in all fairness, the launch has been buggier than anything they've launched in some time and that gives all the opening some people need.

Some people are laughably obvious about it, and I'm happy to poke at them every so often, but it's not really that big a deal. I bought this product to enjoy the long runway of developmental progress and fun it offered, and Line 6 has not disappointed me on either front. The Helix also went through waves of rather negative reception throughout its lifecycle, and ultimately....not one word of that mattered.

And for those who are staying away from Stadium with actual good faith critiques and things missing for their personal use case, I just quote @Digital Igloo: It'll get better.

 

[MadMaxG79]

I've been thinking a little more about this and I don't think I'd buy a modeler today that didn't natively support NAM captures. Which admittedly rules out a lot modelers right now - which is good for me since I'm not currently in the market for one.

And it's not because I necessarily think that NAM captures are the end-all-be-all of digital guitar tone - I just really like the idea of an excellent sounding, well functioning and free-to-play digital solution that is supported across multiple gear manufacturers, so that I can concentrate on selecting the unit that has the right form factor, feature set and UI for my personal use.

 

[Mongillo19]

Dumb question but if Steven suddenly changes his mind and wanted to charge for NAM or atleast make it non open source, where would that leave products who have implemented it in their hardware?

 

[Jarick]

To be fair, what non-affiliated "artists" are "really raving" about QC Mini or AM4?

I took a look at the YT presence for the AM4, and the vast majority of vids were from a month ago. Aside from Leon Todd, most of the recent content is from people selling presets for it.

That's just the way of the GearTuber-sphere now. I'm already seeing "Why I'm selling my QC Mini!" vids too. It's one big repeating cycle of uninspired meh.

I would actually agree that there seems to be more vinegar than usual for Line 6 and this product, but in all fairness, the launch has been buggier than anything they've launched in some time and that gives all the opening some people need.

Some people are laughably obvious about it, and I'm happy to poke at them every so often, but it's not really that big a deal. I bought this product to enjoy the long runway of developmental progress and fun it offered, and Line 6 has not disappointed me on either front. The Helix also went through waves of rather negative reception throughout its lifecycle, and ultimately....not one word of that mattered.

And for those who are staying away from Stadium with actual good faith critiques and things missing for their personal use case, I just quote @Digital Igloo: It'll get better.

Loved this video about the hype around QC Mini, in the spirit of an Orvillian rant combined with Modeler Wars:

(can't embed because of language/age restrictions)

 

[mikah912]

I've been thinking a little more about this and I don't think I'd buy a modeler today that didn't natively support NAM captures. Which admittedly rules out a lot modelers right now - which is good for me since I'm not currently in the market for one.

And it's not because I necessarily think that NAM captures are the end-all-be-all of digital guitar tone - I just really like the idea of an excellent sounding, well functioning and free-to-play digital solution that is supported across multiple gear manufacturers, so that I can concentrate on selecting the unit that has the right form factor, feature set and UI for my personal use.

Uh, which hardware actually does that without being limited to converting a NAM file to their proprietary format or running a "lite" version?

 

[molul]

TOP's new terms of service sent a bunch of people looking for another forum and it seems a few of them ended up here.

Wow. What were the new terms about? "Behave"?

 

[Chocol8]

Wow. What were the new terms about? "Behave"?

"We own everything you post and will be selling it to train AI"

 

[AlbertA]

Uh, which hardware actually does that without being limited to converting a NAM file to their proprietary format or running a "lite" version?

Sonulab? https:// thegearforum.com/threads/sonulab-stompstation-pro-nam-player-pedal.10878/

 

[sashimi]

"We own everything you post and will be selling it to train AI"

Does anything on the internet really need to be sold to train AI? Isn’t AI already reading it all anyway? I asked AI a question about features on pedals a while back and it pulled answers that were obviously from this forum, from threads that I remember participating in, so it’s not like you’re safe from AI stealing your thoughts here.

 

[Chocol8]

Does anything on the internet really need to be sold to train AI? Isn’t AI already reading it all anyway? I asked AI a question about features on pedals a while back and it pulled answers that were obviously from this forum, from threads that I remember participating in, so it’s not like you’re safe from AI stealing your thoughts here.

I think it's more AI stealing music etc. without copyright. If you post music to TOP, they own the right to sell it.

 

[mbenigni]

It went bye-bye a ways back

 

[AlbertA]

Dumb question but if Steven suddenly changes his mind and wanted to charge for NAM or atleast make it non open source, where would that leave products who have implemented it in their hardware?

Assuming they used the inferencing code as is, he released it under MIT license. He cannot retroactively revoke the rights already granted for the code that is currently public. Only future versions would have a different license.

So nothing would change.

 

[Jarick]

Wow. What were the new terms about? "Behave"?

It's gotten more and more obnoxious. There's MFA on every device that you need to resubmit every 30 days, and now there's a pervasive TOS update that floats around. It seems pretty clear the site was purchased without any clear plan to improve or maintain, and it's likely just going to start monetizing more and more.

TGF to me is positioned extremely well to grab more users as it's honestly very familiar (name and content) and brand agnostic, so we should 100% expect people to start coming over more and more.

 

[paisleywookiee]

Does anything on the internet really need to be sold to train AI? Isn’t AI already reading it all anyway? I asked AI a question about features on pedals a while back and it pulled answers that were obviously from this forum, from threads that I remember participating in, so it’s not like you’re safe from AI stealing your thoughts here.

I think it's more AI stealing music etc. without copyright. If you post music to TOP, they own the right to sell it.

We should poison the AI well, with absurd information. Wait.....we already do that.