playing direct be like

[sleewell]

played my first show w no amp on stage on sat. it actually went really well. tone was really good and the mix was great in the crowd but i missed my stage volume. i kept asking for more but the guy was kinda a dick about it. i def enjoyed not hauling my amp and 4x12 hahahah, we got setup and torn down so much faster than the other bands.

 

[Guitarwiz007]

Use IEM's and have a way to do your own monitor mix. I ditched my amps completely about 7 years ago. Don't miss them and don't want them. On occasion, depending on the venue (doesn't have front fills), I'll use my FR-12 just so the people up front aren't just hearing all drums but that is a rare occasion. Now I wonder why they can't just make a tube amp that sounds as good as my Kemper through IEM's.

 

[ian_dissonance]

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played my first show w no amp on stage on sat. it actually went really well. tone was really good and the mix was great in the crowd but i missed my stage volume. i kept asking for more but the guy was kinda a dick about it. i def enjoyed not hauling my amp and 4x12 hahahah, we got setup and torn down so much faster than the other bands.

TL;DR: get some in-ears if you want to go ampless.

Ampless/controlled volume stages work best with in-ears. In-ears work best if you’re running your own. Running your own requires another $3k in gear for the band. It all seems like a lot at first, but with both of my bands we actually get shit on and off faster and never have to worry about the quality of the monitoring. We actually started doing it long before we started playing with clicks and tracks just to avoid the concern over hearing each other and ourselves. Even with cabs on stage, unless you’re the most boring performer ever you’re never going to be in the best place to hear everything all night. I haven’t touched my IEM mix in like a year other than cutting some bass on my aux send if the room is really boomy.

 

[laxu]

TL;DR: get some in-ears if you want to go ampless.

Ampless/controlled volume stages work best with in-ears. In-ears work best if you’re running your own. Running your own requires another $3k in gear for the band. It all seems like a lot at first, but with both of my bands we actually get shit on and off faster and never have to worry about the quality of the monitoring. We actually started doing it long before we started playing with clicks and tracks just to avoid the concern over hearing each other and ourselves. Even with cabs on stage, unless you’re the most boring performer ever you’re never going to be in the best place to hear everything all night. I haven’t touched my IEM mix in like a year other than cutting some bass on my aux send if the room is really boomy.

What kind of gear do you use for this?

 

[JiveTurkey]

TL;DR: get some in-ears if you want to go ampless.

Ampless/controlled volume stages work best with in-ears. In-ears work best if you’re running your own. Running your own requires another $3k in gear for the band. It all seems like a lot at first, but with both of my bands we actually get shit on and off faster and never have to worry about the quality of the monitoring. We actually started doing it long before we started playing with clicks and tracks just to avoid the concern over hearing each other and ourselves. Even with cabs on stage, unless you’re the most boring performer ever you’re never going to be in the best place to hear everything all night. I haven’t touched my IEM mix in like a year other than cutting some bass on my aux send if the room is really boomy.

Who paid for the IEM rig? I think the biggest issue I forsee on this process with bands is getting everyone on board and willing to chip in. I'm not spending $3k of my own gig money to get this going for our band if everyone else isn't going to do their part.

 

[ian_dissonance]

What kind of gear do you use for this?

Behringer XR18, Shure PSM300 systems, ART or Seismic XLR Splitter, XLR whip for split outputs. We trigger our kicks and run an OH condenser for drum/stage spill. I’ve used various modelers, bassist uses a darkglass B7K Ultra. I still have an FR212 or the EVH FR since most places we play don’t have front/side fills, but I don’t need it to hear anything. We’ve had quite a few rehearsals where I’ve forgotten to even turn my speaker on.

 

[sleewell]

i hear ya on IEMs but i dont think were going this route very often. 95% of the time we play shows where cabs are provided and you just show up with your amp. cabs are not micd you just play super loud. this was just a random bar show we were asked to play. i saw pics of their previous shows and realized we could probably make it work going direct. plus it was super hot and i didnt wanna load as much gear lol

i feel like in ears would be a solution if we were going to do this a lot but i just would have been happy in this instance with more guitar coming through the monitor.

 

[ian_dissonance]

Who paid for the IEM rig? I think the biggest issue I forsee on this process with bands is getting everyone on board and willing to chip in. I'm not spending $3k of my own gig money to get this going for our band if everyone else isn't going to do their part.

We all did, for the most part. I bought the mixers just so they’re mine, but everything else was an even split. I always find it amusing that people will spend $2k on a guitar or a drum set that does nothing for their performance, but can’t find $500 to chip in for a IEM set.

 

[ian_dissonance]

i hear ya on IEMs but i dont think were going this route very often. 95% of the time we play shows where cabs are provided and you just show up with your amp. cabs are not micd you just play super loud. this was just a random bar show we were asked to play. i saw pics of their previous shows and realized we could probably make it work going direct. plus it was super hot and i didnt wanna load as much gear lol

i feel like in ears would be a solution if we were going to do this a lot but i just would have been happy in this instance with more guitar coming through the monitor.

Those are the shows where the IEMs really shine, IMO. Noisy ass dives/basements with no monitoring and shitty FOH are the hardest to hear everything.

 

[JiveTurkey]

We all did, for the most part. I bought the mixers just so they’re mine, but everything else was an even split. I always find it amusing that people will spend $2k on a guitar or a drum set that does nothing for their performance, but can’t find $500 to chip in for a IEM set.

Absolutely. Just like anything else; people need to all be in on it vs. one person.

 

[JiveTurkey]

i hear ya on IEMs but i dont think were going this route very often. 95% of the time we play shows where cabs are provided and you just show up with your amp. cabs are not micd you just play super loud. this was just a random bar show we were asked to play. i saw pics of their previous shows and realized we could probably make it work going direct. plus it was super hot and i didnt wanna load as much gear lol

i feel like in ears would be a solution if we were going to do this a lot but i just would have been happy in this instance with more guitar coming through the monitor.

Finding a good powered monitor is as good of a nice in between of these approaches as you will get. The Fender, the EVH Hypersonic, the Laney are all easy to carry and give you that stage volume you want without being insanely loud or weigh a metric ton to transport.


It's all a slippery slope back to amp land, obviously

 

[Guitarwiz007]

Who paid for the IEM rig? I think the biggest issue I forsee on this process with bands is getting everyone on board and willing to chip in. I'm not spending $3k of my own gig money to get this going for our band if everyone else isn't going to do their part.

I agree with your sentiment. Once we all agreed we needed to go IEM, we all chipped in for a "system". We held back money from a few gigs and bought some Sennheiser units, enough to do 6 wireless mixes. It was a full band decision. And since it was gig money, the system will stay with the band if anyone leaves. Any disbandment will result in the sale of the units and split the money. We've been playing for 10 years and have no plans on stopping any time soon. So far so good. Asking one person to take on the entire burden probably wouldn't have had a good of result. Silent stages are wonderful but took a bit to get used to.

 

[sleewell]

Those are the shows where the IEMs really shine, IMO. Noisy ass dives/basements with no monitoring and shitty FOH are the hardest to hear everything.

ive seen more than a few ppl totally face plant that way hahahahah. saw one band do it and kill it but mostly they take forever to setup, they start swearing that this never happens, blah blah blah, and it kills the vibe. we have a really good pa but most DIY shows do not so trusting everything to the pa is not even a risk i would consider.

 

[JiveTurkey]

I agree with your sentiment. Once we all agreed we needed to go IEM, we all chipped in for a "system". We held back money from a few gigs and bought some Sennheiser units, enough to do 6 wireless mixes. It was a full band decision. And since it was gig money, the system will stay with the band if anyone leaves. Any disbandment will result in the sale of the units and split the money. We've been playing for 10 years and have no plans on stopping any time soon. So far so good. Asking one person to take on the entire burden probably wouldn't have had a good of result. Silent stages are wonderful but took a bit to get used to.

If everyone is on board with this thought process; it's great. It's when you have the one (or two or three) people doing the whole "Actually" thing when the trouble starts

 

[ian_dissonance]

ive seen more than a few ppl totally face plant that way hahahahah. saw one band do it and kill it but mostly they take forever to setup, they start swearing that this never happens, blah blah blah, and it kills the vibe. we have a really good pa but most DIY shows do not so trusting everything to the pa is not even a risk i would consider.

Definitely seen that a few times myself, but I’ve seen guys at those shows blow their amps during line check or forget gear or break something etc. Shit happens. If it’s going to be a hassle because the PA sucks or the guy running it is an idiot there’s always just grabbing the main out from our rig and doing it myself, which still usually goes faster than most bands can get their cymbals and pedals on the shared drum kit. We just did this Saturday for a fundraiser show. PA was one of the bands’ practice setups with some decent powered speakers and a 4 channel mixer. One line from our rack, go out front with my phone for 30 seconds, done. Never having to worry about if I can hear the band > taking 2 minutes longer to set up or not looking punk rock enough, lol. If everyone is gonna sound like ass because of the venue, at least I know we’ll be the tightest ass on stage.

 

[Guitarwiz007]

If everyone is on board with this thought process; it's great. It's when you have the one (or two or three) people doing the whole "Actually" thing when the trouble starts

And you are absolutely correct! I came into this band with my own IEM system. I have long since sold it off when we went with our current system. We even upgraded recently (in the last year). We hire FOH sound but carry our own in ear and wireless mic rack. I will run my monitor mix as well as our singers mix since she doesn't feel comfortable with that. I do realize that I'm in a luckier situation than most of the bands even in our area have the luxury to be in. We pull in good money, good crowds and we all get along. Our families even go on trips together so there is a lot of support and comradery there.

I think the way we went about it is best as we all agreed that there could be a time if someone leaves the band there will be no monetary "payback" and we're all good with that but that's why we took it off the top of gig money so nobody has to technically come out of pocket with that considerable expense. Again, I'm one of the lucky ones.

 

[metropolis_4]

I wish I didn’t hate IEMs as much as I do.

For theater productions we do a thing called Sitzprobe where the orchestra and cast sit in a room and run through the music. Typically there is a small PA for the cast mics and everything else is just heard a acoustic in the room. It is always amazing and sounds 1,000x better than the shows when we’re running through the system and IEMs.

Nothing can compare to the experience of hearing everything raw and acoustic reverberating together in a good room

 

[Baba]

by the time you carry the IEM/Mixer rack, you could have carried an amp in . . .


I keed, I keed. I use IEMs, and have been, for the most part, for the last 20+ years.

 

[ian_dissonance]

by the time you carry the IEM/Mixer rack, you could have carried an amp in . . .


I keed, I keed. I use IEMs, and have been, for the most part, for the last 20+ years.

Going direct and splitting to FOH and having speakers on stage is roughly the same amount of stuff (in my case, anyways) but more of the stuff is dedicated to performing well instead of the guitar sounding “good”. It’s definitely not necessarily less stuff or less to carry or whatever.

 

[Alonious_Monk]

I play guitar in an industrial/EBM style band, we're usually sandwiched between DJ's on Goth Nights, and other bands that have a more electronic-based setup.

So we get sound guys that aren't used to micing up anything, so we have to rely of straight-to-FOH setups.

Our drummer (I use the term loosely, he hits percussion pads, never practices.....don't ask), is highly autistic with ADHD, he won't have anything to do with IEM's as he's not the one who came up with the idea. So we have to rely on a good mix from the monitors so he can keep in time (which is 50/50).