Pick the real amp out from the emulations

[Eagle]

Do you think digital device into a good power amp comes close to the real deal?

In to a tube power amp a guitar cab is definitely better. Axe into fryette in to guitar cab is very close. As soon as you go frfr it goes to hell.

 

[Orvillain]

I haven’t done any in depth tests but I’ve always been very impressed how well plugins, digital units and preamp pedals sound running through an amps power section into a cab. It instantly falls into the category of “the real deal” to me…. But again it’s not a test really it’s just enjoying things as a player.

As I alluded to, the best setup I've had was Fryette Powerstation 100watt, Axe FX III, and my 4x12 Egnater cab. For live usage, I'd need to add my FC-12 into the mix, and probably a couple of extra expression pedals for wah and volume and all that.

But the rig would honestly be no more lighter or convenient than using a real amp head, to be honest. The only advantage it really gives is being able to do much more complex patches and signal routing, and would easily lead me down a rabbit hole of not writing songs, and just doing clever-dick shit for the sake of it.

I'm pretty comfortable with my Mark V and some pedals at this point. Axe III for home use.

 

[[Nathan]]

As I alluded to, the best setup I've had was Fryette Powerstation 100watt, Axe FX III, and my 4x12 Egnater cab. For live usage, I'd need to add my FC-12 into the mix, and probably a couple of extra expression pedals for wah and volume and all that.

But the rig would honestly be no more lighter or convenient than using a real amp head, to be honest. The only advantage it really gives is being able to do much more complex patches and signal routing, and would easily lead me down a rabbit hole of not writing songs, and just doing clever-dick shit for the sake of it.

I'm pretty comfortable with my Mark V and some pedals at this point. Axe III for home use.

Haha yeah for live use if you’re carting around. 4ru rack case or more for the axe and power conditioner and whatever else you might have, you’ve easily surpassed a 100w head in size. There’s ways to scale down the operation with ss power amps or rack tube power amps but yeah, the mark is just baller and a nugget size wise, great choice

 

[Sascha Franck]

Running my X88ir directly in to my ""FRFR"" can’t hold a candle to the analog out in to my VHT and a 4x12”

I gather you have a FRFR system with sufficient real speaker estate to compete with a 4x12 then, correct?

 

[Orvillain]

Haha yeah for live use if you’re carting around. 4ru rack case or more for the axe and power conditioner and whatever else you might have, you’ve easily surpassed a 100w head in size. There’s ways to scale down the operation with ss power amps or rack tube power amps but yeah, the mark is just baller and a nugget size wise, great choice

hahaha! Baller is a word that doesn't get used enough!!

 

[Sascha Franck]

Right, but I think that's where I disagree. From a recording standpoint, real amps, real cabs, real mics, and real air moving in a real room, still rules.

Where's the graphs to prove that?

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Everyone knows FRFR’s suck ass if you’re comparing to a poweramp driving a cab. And a valve poweramp driving a cab is always the benchmark, it’s going to be perfect because it’s what the others are attempting to replicate.

Where's the graphs to prove that?

Tbf, the last test in this thread is using the most CPU intensive modern capturing tech available, and it’s still audibly different. Whether something is better not will always be subjective, but the capture tech, and algorithmic models all have a trade off on the real deal - even in an example under the microphone. So I think it’s a perfectly valid belief for someone to hold.

 

[spawnofthesith]

I do agree that modellers sound their best plugged into a tube power section + real cab.... but that at that point you're just using a tube amp with extra steps/complexity/failpoints/money

 

[Orvillain]

Where's the graphs to prove that?

Encore Une Fois.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Encore Une Fois.

Yes please.

 

[Eagle]

I gather you have a "FRFR" system with sufficient real speaker estate to compete with a 4x12 then, correct?

Yes but I generally use my mesa 2x12 for comparison in this.

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

In to a tube power amp a guitar cab is definitely better. Axe into fryette in to guitar cab is very close. As soon as you go "FRFR" it goes to hell.

“As soon as I start eating an orange, it never tastes anything like an apple”.

 

[Eagle]

“As soon as I start eating an orange, it never tastes anything like an apple”.

Except when the orange seller swears it’s an apples . Did you even read the op post??

 

[Sascha Franck]

Did you even read the op post??

Possiby you didn't?

 

[[Nathan]]

Except when the orange seller swears it’s an apples . Did you even read the op post??

To be frank you’ve got a weird attitude to all of this. It’s a reasonably simple recording comparison where there’s nuances between each digital version compared to the amp. Noones selling you anything, noones making claims that these are replacing amps, noones talking about FRFR. The whole conversation has steered for some reason when it’s really just a simple listening and comparing exercise.

The setup is extremely valid because the real amp was recorded in a way people record amps. The NAM captures are trying to replicate what the amp is producing, it’s all pretty straightforward stuff that has nothing to do with replacing amps, in the room sound or FRFR

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

Except when the orange seller swears it’s an apples . Did you even read the op post??

get out of 2016 and make your way to the present.

 

[Lysander]

I haven’t done any in depth tests but I’ve always been very impressed how well plugins, digital units and preamp pedals sound running through an amps power section into a cab.

This was the winning combination, right until silent stages became popular.

I've caught countless bands playing modellers into the FX loop of backline amps, and you could not tell the difference without watching.

 

[Chocol8]

In to a tube power amp a guitar cab is definitely better. Axe into fryette in to guitar cab is very close. As soon as you go "FRFR" it goes to hell.

That is because standard IR's are a bad simulation of a cab.

 

[laxu]

As I alluded to, the best setup I've had was Fryette Powerstation 100watt, Axe FX III, and my 4x12 Egnater cab. For live usage, I'd need to add my FC-12 into the mix, and probably a couple of extra expression pedals for wah and volume and all that.

But the rig would honestly be no more lighter or convenient than using a real amp head, to be honest. The only advantage it really gives is being able to do much more complex patches and signal routing, and would easily lead me down a rabbit hole of not writing songs, and just doing clever-dick shit for the sake of it.

I'm pretty comfortable with my Mark V and some pedals at this point. Axe III for home use.

Pretty much the same experience. Plus once you have that real cab in the mix, it's a whole lot less interesting to try a lot of amp models because the poweramp and cab will greatly influence the tone more than what happens with direct recording with cab sims where you can pair that 1x12 Jensen/JBL Ir with a Deluxe Reverb, or 2x12 Alnico Blues with a Vox style amp etc.

To be fair the Mark V is one of the most versatile amps ever made. If you had a collection of different cabs/speakers you could probably do almost anything with it. As long as you are willing to spin those knobs like a madman and take pictures or write down settings.

 

[Sascha Franck]

That is because standard IR's are a bad simulation of a cab.

No. It's just that they don't interact with the amp. The IRs otherwise represent a cab pretty fine (apart from the mic portion within the IR, which can be taken care of).