How hard do I pick?

[Sascha Franck]

Back to my original post .

Which I don't agree with, at least not entirely.

 

[Rocco Crocco]

Genrerally I pick hard, especially for rhythm guitar.

 

[norminal]

Picking dynamics is another facet of one’s technique.

I pick as soft or as hard as I need to, depending on what the part demands. For example, to pull off those SRV leads, you almost certainly have to dig-in hard. For very fast runs with alternate or economy picking, lighter picking wins the race 99% of the time. That is, unless you’re Rick Graham.

 

[Sascha Franck]

There is a ceiling limit that comes from the instrument . Fret a note and pick it hard enough to cause the string to slap on the next fret. This is the maximum on this instrument with these strings and this set up . It is not down to you unless you change the instrument. This is where I said higher ,harder ,heavier are not better. How do you think that hitting the note harder than the instrument is capable of sounding is going to do anything other than sound bad. This is the dynamic range ceiling.

See, I didn't start this thread to discuss the impacts of picking strength on instrument tone. It obviously has got something to do with it, too, but starting this thread wasn't about it.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Genrerally I pick hard, especially for rhythm guitar.

Similar here - but that's obviously causing some issues when using just one sound for both chord playing and the occasional line. Not only do you go from thick sounding chords to single notes, in case you'll pick the latter softer, there's even gonna be a considerable loss in volume and/or drive.
Personally, I notice this a lot when playing some sort of jazzy/funky stuff, using just a nice and thick clean patch. On quite some of those occasions, I explicitely don't want to switch sounds but do it all through the guitar and my playing. But once the chord playing is getting a bit funkier (hence the picking is getting harder), any lines will defenitely fall short in volume, unless I pick them really hard.
Interestingly enough, that's way less of a problem on nylon strings (I usually play pick and finger style on them), on those I can even play funky kinda rhythms (which I actually quite like on nylons) pretty lightly, so getting leads on top is easy.

 

[Sascha Franck]

For example, to pull off those SRV leads, you almost certainly have to dig-in hard.

Not too sure about it, really. Listen to Billy Gibbons. Sure, it's a somewhat different thing, but the attitude and sound "timbre" of his leads sometimes are comparable to SRV. And he's using - what? - 7ths. or 7.5ths. If he'd dig in all that hard, it'd be a warbling tuning mess.
Apparently Paul Gilbert is picking very lightly, too (and using very thin picks) - defenitely doesn't sound like it to my ears.

 

[Piing]

 

[FAKA!]

I pick super hard... party cause my hands are like grape ape holding a guitar... I pretty much only play metal riffs, no solos, and picking hard with heavy gauged strings sounds way more kickass in a recording than not picking hard... and on top of that I moved to stone picks a few years ago so even when I double pick it sounds like im down picking everything Hetfield style

 

[Sascha Franck]

Which is why how hard you pick is entirely down to the instrument

No, just no. It's only one of quite some parameters. Picking strength is a WHOLE lot more about how effortlessly I can pick, the way the instrument deals with it is completely irrelevant in comparison to that.

 

[Sascha Franck]

You need a relaxed hand to pick efficiently .

Look at the video above. Does that look efficiently or doesn't it?
Also, I guess that'd make @FAKA!'s picking completely wrong, yes?

And if you think tone is secondary to your picking technique then I suggest you have it the wrong way around.

You just don't get it, sorry.
At least on electric guitars, all tonal things can be adjusted to suit your picking very easily, no need to do it the other way around. After all (again see above), on a picking strength scale of 0-10, I'm not talking about the differences between 10 and 1 but rather about the differences between, say, 6 and 7.

 

[Sascha Franck]

In your video I hear your guitar setup choking the dynamic negating the difference and working against you. Not a good fundamental set up for the way you are playing .

I like that tone and most others do so as well. So who wins?
And fwiw, there's a compressor at play. If you think that's "choked dynamics", be it so, but I didn't go for an oldschool jazz tone (the guitar would not provide that anyway).

 

[Sascha Franck]

I must be missing your point because picking harder or softer is about the guitar you are playing and how to manipulate the dynamic range in it not the other way around when you find your set up.

Defenitely not. That'd mean I'd have to pick totally different when changing guitars, it'd also mean I'd have to pick totally different when changing sounds and so on. Not feasible. Or rather: Not desirable in the least.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Every time you pick up an acoustic or a different style of instrument that is exactly what you need to do.

Acoustic = yes, electric = no.

 

[Aleman]

There is a ceiling limit that comes from the instrument . Fret a note and pick it hard enough to cause the string to slap on the next fret. This is the maximum on this instrument with these strings and this set up . It is not down to you unless you change the instrument. This is where I said higher ,harder ,heavier are not better. How do you think that hitting the note harder than the instrument is capable of sounding is going to do anything other than sound bad. This is the dynamic range ceiling.

I agree with you. For whatever reason, possibly the evil horns in my "FRFR" speakers, I hear fret rattle and buzz like never before. But if I ease up on picking, the notes sound more clear and defined. That fret slap on the attack doesn’t sound good if you’re hitting too hard. So I’m picking lighter than I used to. I brought my Strat to a guy to see if I could bring down my action and he said it was all good on the neck. He suggested using a lighter touch or using heavier strings if I wanted to go lower. Makes sense to me.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Everybody else does or they sound bad.

We should stop this discussion, seriously. Or rather, you should. Terribly sorry and it seems you're a great guitar repair dude, but you don't seem to grasp what I'm on about. Because it's got zero to do with the way my guitars are set up. So we're wasting time and whatever resources further elaborating about that.

 

[Sascha Franck]

For whatever reason, possibly the evil horns in my "FRFR" speakers, I hear fret rattle and buzz like never before

Let me assure you: This thread hasn't been started because there were any sonic issues on my side. Not. At. All.

 

[Sascha Franck]

I think you should try again to explain .

No. My original post is very clear and it says *zero* about any tonal aspects. In addition, I said so more than once ever since.
I can pick any of my commonly used guitars at any strength without ever running into any tonal issues. In fact, I have never been happier with my sounds overall.
This is *only* about how efficiently and effortless whatever parts could possibly be played at whatever picking strengths. Nothing less, nothing more.

 

[Sascha Franck]

There is nothing to talk about.

Correct - in that case you have nothing to talk about in this thread. As easy as that.
And accusing me of poor technique or having no idea about picking in general is laughable. You've sealed the deal with that. Bye.

 

[Sascha Franck]

You certainly can't. And it's not even about that.

 

[Aleman]

Let me assure you: This thread hasn't been started because there were any sonic issues on my side. Not. At. All.

You started a thread about how to pick. I offered my experience on the subject from a tonal aspect. Not. Sorry.