Digital Igloo (Eric Klein, YGG)

Digital Igloo said:
We do alllllll sorts of tests. Double-blind A/B/X tests have the original matched cab always active for both the amp (so it's loaded properly) and model. Null tests measure output signals from the preamp outputs, power amp outputs, and mics in front of said cab. Studio monitors are sometimes used, but the real test is in front of the cab in the live room. Success for us is if the model sounds and feels somewhere between two different amps of the same make and model (and ideally, same year); if it's outside of those two, we've failed and we keep tweaking. Sometimes we'll scrap it and start over.
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As someone who's recently gone back to 112 tube amps, I have to say the overall simplicity and ease of enjoyment has been quite liberating. That said, I'm still using my full-fat Helix for an elaborate and excellent pedalboard. The most obvious difference to me is how a real guitar speaker acts in a room, in my case a 65 Greenback, and I have good "FRFR" monitors for comparison, two 12-inch co-axials from Dynacord who have now been bought out by Electro-Voice.

When I was testing, sometimes I was convinced that I wasn't set up correctly because of the way the guitar speaker spreads from both front and rear and an open-back combo, it can almost have a stereo effect in the room. What I’m not so sure about is it really the same thing to hook up a Class D power amp to a guitar cab and run a digital model into it? Do tube power amps not behave and respond differently than a flat Class D amp? What's the data on that?
 
CakeEater said:
But can the audio signal emulating the power amp behaviour make them sound the same, or are there physical or electrical differences that go beyond the signal.
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Of course it can be emulated. Whether that's already happening is another thing.
And then there's a certain interaction between tube power amps and speakers. Some modelers are as well emulating that, but if you are monitoring through a class D amp and a guitar cab, the modeler would ideally use the same "invisible" cab to recreate the interaction, which possibly wouldn't be available. But we might already be in the land of diminishing returns here.
 
CakeEater said:
What I’m not so sure about is it really the same thing to hook up a Class D power amp to a guitar cab and run a digital model into it? Do tube power amps not behave and respond differently than a flat Class D amp? What's the data on that?
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So I currently own a Fryette PS-100 (100W all-tube, neutral poweramp) and a BluGuitar Amp 1 Mercury Edition (Class D solid-state poweramp rated like a 100W tube amp).

It's been a while but I've tried them both through the same cab with the Axe-Fx 3. The difference between the Fryette and BluGuitar when used with a modeler was IMO that the BluGuitar acted more like a guitar poweramp, because that's what it's designed to do.

With a full amp model running into them, the BluGuitar can be a bit more hyped in the highs and lows, whereas the Fryette is more neutral. The Fryette's presence/depth controls are fairly subtle until you turn them pretty high. I should test that scenario next time I can to see if that makes the Fryette more "guitar poweramp-ish".

Now take this with a grain of salt because the BluGuitar is one of the better Class D amps out there, thanks to some BluGuitar proprietary black magic. I've always been happy with how it sounds with any modeler, and it's of course a kickass amp in its own right.

The Class D poweramps are not all built equal. You will find a lot of different stuff that runs the ICEPower Class D poweramp modules. These are found in many bass amps, the Seymour Duncan Power Stage, Kemper Toaster, Fender Tone Master combos...they're alright, but might not blow your mind.

So to answer your question, technically the modeler and SS poweramp should be enough...but experience can vary.
 
Hi @Digital Igloo

I have a question for you as Helix-expert:

What's the best way to use the HX line (in my case the Helix Floor) as an interface to play with plugins in Win11? Is there a prefered way or should I just put up a blank preset with output set to "USB 1/2"?
 
BahamaDada said:
Hi @Digital Igloo

I have a question for you as Helix-expert:

What's the best way to use the HX line (in my case the Helix Floor) as an interface to play with plugins in Win11? Is there a prefered way or should I just put up a blank preset with output set to "USB 1/2"?
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Get a different interface. Helix drivers have not real great latency for this kind of thing. Poor planning and implementation IMO considering the existence of Helix Native.
 
I
BahamaDada said:
Hi @Digital Igloo

I have a question for you as Helix-expert:

What's the best way to use the HX line (in my case the Helix Floor) as an interface to play with plugins in Win11? Is there a prefered way or should I just put up a blank preset with output set to "USB 1/2"?
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I just found out how to do this on my Stomp. You can change the input block to USB, set the plugins to use the dry DI input (5/6 on Stomp) and then you can get post-FX via the Helix Floor. So the plugins go first in the signal chain in this case. If the preset is empty it’s going to be just the plugin.

Edit: for the Stomp you set the output in the plugin/DAW to 5/6 as well. Might be different on Floor!

It might not be the best latency but I find it passable on the Helix hardware.
 
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BahamaDada said:
Hi @Digital Igloo

I have a question for you as Helix-expert:

What's the best way to use the HX line (in my case the Helix Floor) as an interface to play with plugins in Win11? Is there a prefered way or should I just put up a blank preset with output set to "USB 1/2"?
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Helix/HX automatically routes everything out USB 1/2 by default so there's nothing to do. :cool:
 
Digital Igloo said:
Not in the middle of a signal chain, but you can certainly place plugins between any of Helix's 4 paths.
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Cool! Is it detailed in the manual somewhere and I’ve just been too stupid to find it? And would it be true for Stomp as well or is it just the biggies?

In my experience the Helix ecosystem has been a gift that keeps on giving and i still feel like I’ve just scratched the surface. Recently finding out that I could change the input block to USB was unreal and has saved me from having to buy more hardware.
 
Progressive_disclosure said:
Cool! Is it detailed in the manual somewhere and I’ve just been too stupid to find it? And would it be true for Stomp as well or is it just the biggies?

In my experience the Helix ecosystem has been a gift that keeps on giving and i still feel like I’ve just scratched the surface. Recently finding out that I could change the input block to USB was unreal and has saved me from having to buy more hardware.
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  1. Set the output block of one path to USB 1/2, 3/4, or 5/6.
  2. In your DAW, choose the USB input selected in step 1 and route it back out USB 3/4, 5/6, or 7/8.
  3. In Helix, set the destination path's Input block to the USB channels selected in step 2.
 
Digital Igloo said:
  1. Set the output block of one path to USB 1/2, 3/4, or 5/6.
  2. In your DAW, choose the USB input selected in step 1 and route it back out USB 3/4, 5/6, or 7/8.
  3. In Helix, set the destination path's Input block to the USB channels selected in step 2.
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I can't get this to work on a HX Stomp then, since I can't switch input and outputs as freely as on the bigger units?

I've gotten closer by setting path B to Send as you wrote and then connecting a physical patch cable from Send to Return L plus setting a Return block on path A, or connect the cable to Input R with the risk of feedback (using a Y-splitter down to path B for separation.

USB interface is then set to input 3 and out 3 (mono is fine for me). Using the send/return with a cable gives me a dry signal as an extra and I can't seem to find how to remove it from the equation.

Is this a doomed project and the answer is "get an LT again" or is there something to be done?
 
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