Will an indefinitely relevant/sold modeling platform ever exist?

[Enchilada Jones]

Hundreds of hours and you STILL haven’t landed on what you like?

I like it all! Seriously.
I gave up trying to choose which is best and I just embrace the whole adventure.

I have two Kempers, FM3, Stadium being delivered in a few days, Genome where I get to use NAM.
A Soldano Astro 20 and a Synergy IR 20 with three modules, Lazy J 20 and Orange Rocker 15 Terror. The real amps are set up to run through a Two Notes Reload II, feeding a pair of studio monitors as well as a pair of 1x12 cabs so stereo either way with VP4 in the Reload effects loop.

It’s a frivolous habit that I absolutely love.
I haven’t played on stage in 20 years ( not that I/we were anything beyond local bar cover band) so I have no justification for it other than I love it.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Fwiw, while I doubt anyone will actually make such a device, I could very easily imagine what an all-in-one modeler would be like, so I'd use it, well, for the rest of my gigging life (for home noodling fun and recording duties, things might be a little different, but not much).
Would easily be possible using nowadays technologies, wouldn't have to be very expensive and would possibly be quite less sophisticated than what some people might think.

It's pretty much a matter of your mindset, though. I actually really like becoming very familiar with one device and then keep using it for a long time (heck, I played a bunch of gigs with a GT-10 in 2024 and had vastly more fun with it than I was expecting - and if it had better amp sounds, I'd likely be using it regularly for one of my gigs).
And well, it's also me being a kind of idealist, if you will. I absolutely despise the constant hunt for the latest and greatest. No details because of "no politics".

 

[Sascha Franck]

They don’t like 5318008 in Germany??

Just googled it. Should've done so before I guess.

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

Fwiw, while I doubt anyone will actually make such a device, I could very easily imagine what an all-in-one modeler would be like, so I'd use it, well, for the rest of my gigging life (for home noodling fun and recording duties, things might be a little different, but not much).
Would easily be possible using nowadays technologies, wouldn't have to be very expensive and would possibly be quite less sophisticated than what some people might think.

It's pretty much a matter of your mindset, though. I actually really like becoming very familiar with one device and then keep using it for a long time (heck, I played a bunch of gigs with a GT-10 in 2024 and had vastly more fun with it than I was expecting - and if it had better amp sounds, I'd likely be using it regularly for one of my gigs).
And well, it's also me being a kind of idealist, if you will. I absolutely despise the constant hunt for the latest and greatest. No details because of "no politics".

It’s that many/most devices are just that and that the flagship stuff is adding absurd stuff like controlling your light show, etc., that had me start this thread.

 

[ragingplatypi]

What would give a multieffects modeler longevity would be if the parts that crap out are relatively easily replaceable. So if there are propriety parts, the modeler that will last will have the most old units out there to scavenge parts from. My assumption is that would be Helix/HX Stomp.

Which is making me think I should stockpile all those bargain HX Effects I see on Craigslist.

 

[Sascha Franck]

It’s that many/most devices are just that and that the flagship stuff is adding absurd stuff like controlling your light show, etc., that had me start this thread.

Yeah well, I can sort of understand that kinda thing - but IMO a long lasting modeling device should be somewhat streamlined and focus on established technology. Adding that kinda stuff is just opening another box of pandora with endless feature requests showing up.

A wellrounded set of features kinda established by whatever how many guitar players over the last decades IMO would be the way to go in case something was supposed to stick around for long.
Very obviously, any such a device needed to be well suited to work at least in a kinda modular fashion, so the core device could stand on its own for a long time, but you would always be able to integrate other stuff for those special moments (regardless whether it's more switches, synth-ish "expansions", elaborated special FX and, well, maybe even light show controllers).

It possibly also needed at least some "playground" bits here and there, offering some options to keep things a tad fresh - things such as capture tech for amps and IRs but also kinda "toolbox" alike FX come to mind. But that stuff would have to be solid as well, because everything extraordinary would very likely trigger yet some more extraordary feature request.

 

[ian_dissonance]

It’s that many/most devices are just that and that the flagship stuff is adding absurd stuff like controlling your light show, etc., that had me start this thread.

I don’t even think it’s that absurd, that’s what a lot of people want to do with their show. I just don’t want or need it all in one box. One point of failure is really good for a guitar rig, and a backing track player, and a light controller, and an IEM setup. A single point of failure for ALL of those things sounds like a literal nightmare to me. Solid amps/cabs, solid FX, reliability, and configurable switching is what I need from my guitar rig. Not even the bestest of any of those things if it means I don’t worry about it all.

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

I don’t even think it’s that absurd, that’s what a lot of people want to do with their show. I just don’t want or need it all in one box. One point of failure is really good for a guitar rig, and a backing track player, and a light controller, and an IEM setup. A single point of failure for ALL of those things sounds like a literal nightmare to me. Solid amps/cabs, solid FX, reliability, and configurable switching is what I need from my guitar rig. Not even the bestest of any of those things if it means I don’t worry about it all.

I mean, the number of consumers of these devices that would be in a position to control a light show, or even play backing tracks, has got to be a pretty overall low percentage. The touch screen and pretty pictures are certainly appealing to a broad base…but I’m just not sure they’re $2k+ appealing to all that many people when pretty much the same sound engine with loads of switching and I/O is available for $1k new.

 

[ian_dissonance]

I mean, the number of consumers of these devices that would be in a position to control a light show, or even play backing tracks, has got to be a pretty overall low percentage. The touch screen and pretty pictures are certainly appealing to a broad base…but I’m just not sure they’re $2k+ appealing to all that many people when pretty much the same sound engine with loads of switching and I/O is available for $1k new.

Most bands I see are doing some form of tracks or samples or lights or automated switching or vocal effects, so even if most of these things are bound for mancaves until the Axe-FX IV comes the ones that do land on stages will probably end up doing something along side guitar processing. If something was available that had all of it in one box 15 years ago I would have been all over it. But I’m arguing about the value of something I don’t even want to use! On topic, I think the stuff coming out now is going to be useful until it dies if it does what you need it to.

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

Most bands I see are doing some form of tracks or samples or lights or automated switching or vocal effects, so even if most of these things are bound for mancaves until the Axe-FX IV comes the ones that do land on stages will probably end up doing something along side guitar processing. If something was available that had all of it in one box 15 years ago I would have been all over it. But I’m arguing about the value of something I don’t even want to use! On topic, I think the stuff coming out now is going to be useful until it dies if it does what you need it to.

Yeah, I just think the percentage of these things that land on an actual stage where the guitar processor MIGHT be able to do any of that (I.e., not many churches) is pretty low.

 

[Orvillain]

I'm old enough to remember when Reason users said it was absurb to add anything to do with audio recording into it, or when Ableton Live users were arguing about the pro's and cons of midi support.

Heh.

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

I'm old enough to remember when Reason users said it was absurb to add anything to do with audio recording into it, or when Ableton Live users were arguing about the pro's and cons of midi support.

Heh.

Not saying these additions are absurd. But they do start to make a non-top tier modeler, even for those with discerning taste, a lot more appealing. Just as Ableton has differentiated into several tiers as the full suite has ballooned and price has climbed.

Maybe that space is just filled with ever developing and upgrading Stomp/AM4s. Or maybe the folks that want stability just go with a pedalboard and an Iridium or whatever. Or maybe something like the Helix LT is made with the idea that it’s not gonna EOL.

 

[Orvillain]

Not saying these additions are absurd. But they do start to make a non-top tier modeler, even for those with discerning taste, a lot more appealing. Just as Ableton has differentiated into several tiers as the full suite has ballooned and price has climbed.

Maybe that space is just filled with ever developing and upgrading Stomp/AM4s. Or maybe the folks that want stability just go with a pedalboard and an Iridium or whatever. Or maybe something like the Helix LT is made with the idea that it’s not gonna EOL.

<narrator>
But he did in fact, say they were absurd.
</narrator>

the flagship stuff is adding absurd stuff like controlling your light show, etc.

 

[ragingplatypi]

I think it’s worth looking at keyboards to see where this is going. Korg, Yamaha, and Roland have their classic sounds that get repackaged in each new generation of products. All of them make sure to cover acoustic pianos, electric pianos, organs and certain synth sounds, unless the keyboard is specifically for something else. There’s expensive workstations that cover everything, and then every decade or so they put out a keyboard or series of keyboard that focuses on a small collection of classic sounds. It’s easy to see how guitar gear mirrors this path.

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

<narrator>
But he did in fact, say they were absurd.
</narrator>

(for the general user). Unless the next step in mancave chic is a controllable lighting rig, I would say that particular feature has a very limited audience within the consumers of guitar processors.

 

[Orvillain]

(for the general user). Unless the next step in mancave chic is a controllable lighting rig, I would say that particular feature has a very limited audience within the consumers of guitar processors.

Yeah I get you. I think you're probably right. But also, for the few cases where a band wants to pretend to be Meshuggah lite, I reckon the showcase control stuff could be a ...


mmmm.... a changing of the deck of cards constituted towards some kind of activity aimed at play.....