John Petrucci Triplet/Sextuplet Riffs

[Sascha Franck]

Having just sat here going 1-e-and-a-2-e-and-a-3-e-and-a-4-e-and-a- throughout the part that @la szum is referencing (the run at 3:45), it really doesn't sound like 16th notes to me.

You heard absolutely right!. But well, at least in my world, "1-e-and-a" is describing a 4 note group (typically 16ths). In case it's describing 6 notes in your world, I'd really like to take a sneak peak into that world...

 

[Sascha Franck]

And fwiw, the run is in Dm, starting on an E (all happening over a C chord), pattern is E-C-D-E, F-D-E-F, G-E-D-G, etc. Very typical ascending 16th note pattern.

 

[Eagle]

That's not unexpected, at least in case you're alternate picking. With 3nps the picking direction changes on each string, with 2nps it stays the same.

Economy pick three note shapes.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Economy pick three note shapes.

Personally, I prefer to stay within the alternate picking realm as much as possible. Maybe a result of being a rhythm player mainly.

 

[Eagle]

Personally, I prefer to stay within the alternate picking realm as much as possible. Maybe a result of being a rhythm player mainly.

I just use whatever is easiest in the situation. I constantly switch between the two but I use economy as a default. I don’t however write lines with the picking in mind. The note choice always comes first.

 

[Orvillain]

You heard absolutely right!. But well, at least in my world, "1-e-and-a" is describing a 4 note group (typically 16ths)

Yes, I agree.

And that isn't what Moore is playing in the run at 3:45 in the song to my ears.

To be clear, he's talking about this bit:

✂️ Out In The Fields solo snippet

5 seconds · Clipped by WiresDreamDisasters · Original video "Gary Moore - Out In The Fields (Official Video)" by Ovidiu Buzdugan Romcea

youtube.com

I don't think that is a simple 16th note run. It doesn't line up 100% with the hihat if you put the hihats on the numbers in: 1-e-and-a-2-e-and-a-3-e-and-a-4-e-and-a-

 

[Sascha Franck]

And that isn't what Moore is playing in the run at 3:45 in the song to my ears.

I described the run's structure already and I could play it to you and record a video, if you wanted (not as fast as Mr. Moore but you could speed it up). The run I described is exactly what's happening there. And yes, I'd hold any (!) bet. Just slow it down to 0.5 and it becomes glaringly obvious.

 

[Sascha Franck]

The note choice always comes first.

This.
And that's why I prefer alternate picking, because it's more alround-ish than economy picking, which often requires adjusting patterns.

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

That's not unexpected, at least in case you're alternate picking. With 3nps the picking direction changes on each string, with 2nps it stays the same.

i meant in keeping the internal rhythm rather than any chops thing.

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

Having just sat here going 1-e-and-a-2-e-and-a-3-e-and-a-4-e-and-a- throughout the part that @la szum is referencing (the run at 3:45), it really doesn't sound like 16th notes to me.

16th at 180bpm
First line has a slur in that makes it 5, but the rest are 16th

 

[Orvillain]

I described the run's structure already and I could play it to you and record a video

G'wan then.

 

[Orvillain]

They're 16th notes here, so I guess that is what it is.

 

[Eagle]

This.
And that's why I prefer alternate picking, because it's more alround-ish than economy picking, which often requires adjusting patterns.

Just legato the odd note here and there and economy will let you blaze smoothly through almost anything.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Just legato the odd note here and there and economy will let you blaze smoothly through almost anything.

I know. I just happen to prefer alternate picking in many situations.

 

[la szum]

I swear I hummed it syllablically. Is that even a word? Syllablically?

Anywho, what do I know. :lol I was just trying to recall a piece of
music from a Gary Moore transcription in my teenage years
(around 1985-6) that was in Guitar For the Practicing Musician.
Great magazine. RIP. Anywho, it was the first time I recall ever seeing
those 6 notes per beat sextuplets, double-time triplet thing-a-ma-jigs.

It may not have been the song or solo I posted.

Been listening to a lot of Gary Moore this week and I hear that same
pattern in other places. He seemed to really like it.

 

[TSJMajesty]

And this one's really crazy. It's from Stream of Consciousness, and I had to correct the tab. It was so wrong that I had to place the final notes in bar 114 before the last bend, back over top of the first notes in 113. And I transposed it (just the sextuplet part) so it can be played in E std (it's recorded a half-step down.)

This was tricky to play at first, until I figured out that once again, JP is using a pattern. In this case it's 3 notes down, 2 up, and 2 down. Shift down and repeat. And he doesn't simply shift down one note in the scale each time. Tbh, I'm not sure how he chose which notes to shift down to each time.

So that 7-note pattern continues until he gets to the low E, then it's basically a 6-note pattern, which is a bit easier to follow.

 

[TSJMajesty]

And for rhythmic "mixing", of sextuplets, 16th notes, & 8th notes, let's go straight to the master of Technical Difficulties, Mr. Paul Gilbert:

Very cool riff, and great practice! It's just on my own edge for tempo. I still can't play any kind of continuous line of sextuplets at 120, but these quick, half-beat ones I can do.

To my ear, the coolest aspect of this riff is the 4 16th notes at the end of every other measure.

And of course the other parts of the song have these mixtures as well.

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

And for rhythmic "mixing", of sextuplets, 16th notes, & 8th notes, let's go straight to the master of Technical Difficulties, Mr. Paul Gilbert:

View attachment 14397Very cool riff, and great practice! It's just on my own edge for tempo. I still can't play any kind of continuous line of sextuplets at 120, but these quick, half-beat ones I can do.

To my ear, the coolest aspect of this riff is the 4 16th notes at the end of every other measure.

And of course the other parts of the song have these mixtures as well.

While mixing rhythmic values on open strings is good start i was talking about something like this at 130-150 bpm