It almost killed me but….

[Alex Kenivel]

Kickass!

I miss my music room, albeit much smaller than what you've got going on. The room I'm in is bigger now, but is a shared space

All my panels are shoved in a closet

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I’ll never learn.

Hired a pro studio designer just for some final room tweaks, partly just to control the low stuff even more, and partly just to make things look a bit more cohesive now that I know I’m in a pretty good place.

1st step is just to get things a bit more symmetrical on my sides, figured I can make some diaphragmatic absorbers that’ll help with low frequencies more than regular porous ones. Because of the depth of the panels, I’m using some very low density fibreglass with a diaphragmatic material on the back.

While I’m doing that I’m making a slightly thinner version (23cm vs 30cm deep) as another cloud. Different diaphragmatic properties, my existing cloud will move back towards the middle of the room, and this one will go where my current cloud is.

Doing this will mean I can move some more panels and treatment to my rear wall. But two really tackle the low modal stuff (hello 26hz), I’d need to do some serious work on the rear wall, which would be quite a big undertaking. So we’ll see where I’m at after this and I can consider it then.

Here’s roughly how my decay times look in my room, as there is quite a lot of absorption already, I wouldn’t be surprised if things don’t change THAT much with these going in. Hopefully things even out in the low end a bit more, but at the least it’ll look and feel a bit more cohesive in there.

Exciting stuff!

 

[MirrorProfiles]

the bad news:

I have no idea whether it’ll be better to position soffits, then these panels, then more soffits, or these panels first at the front and then soffits after, or any combination until I’ve measured every option. Unfortunately, that means a lot of moving big and heavy items around the studio all over again.

I know I can’t leave shit alone until I’ve tried and tested everything otherwise it’ll just linger in my head. Options are basically only good as long as you eliminate them.

 

[likitlikeyoulikeit]

 

[MirrorProfiles]

2 of these buggers built. Just the cloud to do tomorrow, as well as a lot of moving cabs and furniture around again, as well as testing and measuring.

2nd one came out a lot nicer than the first, annoying how many small things you learn from the 1st one that make the second plain sailing.

Miserable colour but looks OK in the room, gotta blame scouting for girls for that.

 

[la szum]

That thing is .....

 

[MirrorProfiles]

That thing is .....

Ha they’re pretty massive. But also they’re only 30cm deep while most of the other panels are 40cm or 60cm deep. The design and materials should mean they are at least as effective, but they should actually perform better than what I have if I’ve done a good enough job

 

[la szum]

I'll be building 2 or 3 clouds here shortly. Looks like you are using the looser Fiberglass insulation.
Have you tried the denser/heavier stuff like the Rockwool??

It's so uplifting building stuff with your own hands like that.

 

[la szum]

Rockwool® Mineral Wool 60 Acoustic Insulation - 6Lbs 48"x24"x2" Case of 6

SOLD BY THE CASE OF 6 PIECES PIECE SIZE: 48" x 24" with 2" Thickness HIGHLY FLAME RESISTANT - UP TO 1200℉

www.acoustimac.com

I am still thinking about what material is best to source here.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I'll be building 2 or 3 clouds here shortly. Looks like you are using the looser Fiberglass insulation.
Have you tried the denser/heavier stuff like the Rockwool??

It's so uplifting building stuff with your own hands like that.

I’ve done lots with denser stuff too, essentially it all depends on how deep your panels are.

For thinner panels (up to about 15cm) something like Rockwool (RWA 45) or Roxul Safe n Sound or Knauf Ecose is your best bet - typically rockwool that’s 40kg/m3. 15cm panels wont do a great deal with low end (where the biggest issues are), and for deeper panels you generally want a lower density material (higher density stuff becomes reflective after a certain depth).

It’s hard to find gas flow resistivity values online (which is what matters for acoustic absorption) but they typically follow this trend. For lighter densities, fibreglass is your best bet as far as cost/performance goes.

You can put the values on the Y axis into the porous absorber calculator with your panel depths and you can compare how effective different materials and thicknesses will be.

 

[la szum]

Wow. Thanks!

How about the fabric you are wrapping them with? Suggestions? Thoughts?

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Wow. Thanks!

How about the fabric you are wrapping them with? Suggestions? Thoughts?

I use Camira Cara, I think Guilford of Maine is the US equivalent. It’s acoustically transparent and really nicely made fabric, but unfortunately comes at a cost. I think it’s worth it, but you can use anything light enough where you can feel your breath through it if needed.

I also put a sheet of dacron polyester wadding between the insulation and the fabric, just to contain any potential loose strands of fibreglass. More of an abundance of care, easy to put a layer in and not have to worry about it.

 

[la szum]

Awesome. Thanks so much, Ed! My Winter projects to do here are forming into shape with
your help and expertise.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Awesome. Thanks so much, Ed! My Winter projects to do here are forming into shape with
your help and expertise.

It’s a very satisfying journey! I’d say help and expertise is more like “learn from my many mistakes”.

I don’t know how much space you have to work with (or what you want to achieve), but if you are able to, try and calculate roughly what room modes you’ll be dealing with and see if you can find an optimal depth and material to use. It’s a real benefit of doing it DIY vs (expensive) off the shelf stuff.

 

[la szum]

Appreciate you sharing all of your mistakes here then.

 

[la szum]

I am assuming your Amps and Cabs are in an entirely different room??

Also, can you give a breakdown of your outboard gear (like Comps, EQs, Mic Pres),
or point me to a thread where you maybe have already done so?

Thanks again for the juicy bits to chew on and digest!

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I am assuming your Amps and Cabs are in an entirely different room??

Also, can you give a breakdown of your outboard gear (like Comps, EQs, Mic Pres),
or point me to a thread where you maybe have already done so?

Thanks again for the juicy bits to chew on and digest!

Nah, amps and cabs are at the rear part of the room. Photos are just showing the front half or so. All in a single room though. Would love a seperate live room and booths but realistically most of my work is mixing and mastering and for tracking jobs it’s cool to hire other places when possible.

My rack gear isn’t actually that exciting, I’m very much an ITB guy. Having a nice front end helps though and you can get some nice tonal colour with preamps you can drive a bit.

Converters are RME ADI-2 PRO FS R BE, and a UCX II hooked up together.

Mic preamps are API A2D, Chandler TG-2, Sound Scourge PQ73 (Neve 1073 clone with some extra eq bands), Focusrite ISA Two. The Neve has a single channel of EQ, the rest are just regular preamps.

I also have 8 channels of Avid (well Digidesign as it’s from that era) preamps which are for leftover channels when doing drums. They’re pretty good sounding and cost like £300. More like “utility” preamps than colour ones.

There’s also a Behringer ADA8200 for leftover A/D, it’s not great but does the job. Pretty noisy compared to better stuff but no issues. Preamps don’t sound bad at all.

Other rack gear is stuff like an Avalon U5 (DI box), Sansamp RBI, Korg tuner, a tray with a reamp box etc and patchbays.

There’s another rack out of picture that has my amp switcher and load boxes in it. I have the switcher hooked up via MIDI so it can be controlled from the desk and it all feeds to and from my patchbay so I can keep it nearer the amps.

Half tempted to grab an 1176 or Distressor for recording vocals with, but I’m not doing it THAT often atm so it’s a bit hard to justify. I’ve tried to focus the really good stuff where it matters, so the ADI-2 converters are recording most stuff. The only time I’m using more than 2 channels is when i’m doing drums, which might be a couple of times a year these days.

One set of monitors receives a digital signal, the other is fed by the ADI-2 D/A. Would be cool if all the conversion was at that level but i’m not mixing with outboard or recording big track counts often enough to justify it.

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

Looks super cool!

Man, those speakers are huuugee

 

[la szum]

Nah, amps and cabs are at the rear part of the room. Photos are just showing the front half or so. All in a single room though. Would love a seperate live room and booths but realistically most of my work is mixing and mastering and for tracking jobs it’s cool to hire other places when possible.

My rack gear isn’t actually that exciting, I’m very much an ITB guy. Having a nice front end helps though and you can get some nice tonal colour with preamps you can drive a bit.

Converters are RME ADI-2 PRO FS R BE, and a UCX II hooked up together.

Mic preamps are API A2D, Chandler TG-2, Sound Scourge PQ73 (Neve 1073 clone with some extra eq bands), Focusrite ISA Two. The Neve has a single channel of EQ, the rest are just regular preamps.

I also have 8 channels of Avid (well Digidesign as it’s from that era) preamps which are for leftover channels when doing drums. They’re pretty good sounding and cost like £300. More like “utility” preamps than colour ones.

There’s also a Behringer ADA8200 for leftover A/D, it’s not great but does the job. Pretty noisy compared to better stuff but no issues. Preamps don’t sound bad at all.

Other rack gear is stuff like an Avalon U5 (DI box), Sansamp RBI, Korg tuner, a tray with a reamp box etc and patchbays.

There’s another rack out of picture that has my amp switcher and load boxes in it. I have the switcher hooked up via MIDI so it can be controlled from the desk and it all feeds to and from my patchbay so I can keep it nearer the amps.

Half tempted to grab an 1176 or Distressor for recording vocals with, but I’m not doing it THAT often atm so it’s a bit hard to justify. I’ve tried to focus the really good stuff where it matters, so the ADI-2 converters are recording most stuff. The only time I’m using more than 2 channels is when i’m doing drums, which might be a couple of times a year these days.

One set of monitors receives a digital signal, the other is fed by the ADI-2 D/A. Would be cool if all the conversion was at that level but i’m not mixing with outboard or recording big track counts often enough to justify it.

Thanks for the breakdown. Appreciate it!

Was curious how much outboard gear you had for the front end, or to use on the output/insert
side for bus mixes... or stereo mixdown of completed tracks. I kind of think that is the way I want
to go at the moment. Hybrid setup.

Any Pros or Cons that you have discovered with such a setup. Seems like a best of both worlds
type of scenario. In theory!

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Thanks for the breakdown. Appreciate it!

Was curious how much outboard gear you had for the front end, or to use on the output/insert
side for bus mixes... or stereo mixdown of completed tracks. I kind of think that is the way I want
to go at the moment. Hybrid setup.

Any Pros or Cons that you have discovered with such a setup. Seems like a best of both worlds
type of scenario. In theory!

HW is fun, and like guitar amps, there’s something to be said for the tactile side of it.

In the world I’m in, changes, new versions, remixes, and stems can be called on at any times and usually with urgency. HW during a mix woukd slow me down so much, and it adds in a variable of having to check its behaving, and watching out for odd things happening. Same goes for delay compensation which just never seems to be totally trustworthy.

I think HW is amazing for recording through on the way in, and I generally think you get more bang for your buck committing on the way in and then doing the rest in the box. But if a hardware compressor or stereo eq inspires you, go for it. Really think about why you want to buy a piece of hardware and what it’s going to do for you. If you can’t get great results with plugins, HW isn’t really going to help.

I love working in the box, I think it’s way superior to analog, although that’s not to say that certain aspects of analog aren’t fun.